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From Sven Vogel <S.Vo...@ewerk.com>
Subject Re: Why CloudStack 5
Date Sat, 26 Jan 2019 12:33:24 GMT
Hi Guys,

That what I say to version 5.

I understand both people these they say version 5.0 is the right way or 4.XX. For a marketing
men version 5 looks like a big deal but under the hood what’s really new? I know there are
new features but what of them is a groundbreaking feature? For me its not important if there
is a 5. Or a 4.XX version.

I see the the stability of the UI is one of the important things we have to do. Hey folks,
a project with a good API but no working UI will not be a cloud environment. In the long run
it will not be interesting for new people.

--My team and me will work in the next months make the jQuery UI better, add features and
try to bug fix. I hope anybody will help. We started with any thing like jQuery library update
and will go further. Normally we don’t need a new UI but we need to fix it and make it better.--

The things to do that are there. I know that any web frontend developer will say oooohhh „jQuery“
its very old lets use a newer thing. We know all that every year new features come new features
and programming languages and everytime there come people they say why you use such a old
…

A good UI is a working UI and one of the important things of a cloud environment! humans are
visual! Not all but I think the most of them. Okay it should looks good and not so ugly but
it should be working and let the people do the things they want to do. I worked with VMware
vCloud and OpenStack too and I think the interface is not so bad. It needs some love :)

Thats what I think for a change from 4.X.X to 5.0.0

5.0.0 Is a Marketing hype and let people outside from cloudstack think there's something going
on...
4.X.X is really without this marketing hype and I think the same like Ivan, what he wrote
is the same what I think.

Maybe maybe you will find a compromise and make a 5.0.0 for the marketing hype let us do what
we do now - cleanup, improving codebase, stabilize the existing functions and add new features!

I see the same like @Ivan.

> Well, my intention is to prevent the community from doing revolutionary
> changes intending to deliver redesigned 5.0, to keep going the current road
> improving the codebase, removing the odd stuff like 'Citrix NetScaler',
> 'Juniper XYZ' if nobody supports them, improving current functionality and
> adding new core features which are opensource without vendor lock-in, e.g.
> SDNs (I know Wido is very into it) e.g. Cumulus infra support. I believe
> current codebase is a pretty capable basement for future stable
> functionality.


@Wido

> SDNs (I know Wido is very into it) e.g. Cumulus infra support

Yes we use cumulus… great!

Sorry for my English.

Thanks Guys


__

Sven Vogel
Teamlead Platform

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you.
> Am 26.01.2019 um 03:36 schrieb Ivan Kudryavtsev <kudryavtsev_ia@bw-sw.com>:
>
> Well, my intention is to prevent the community from doing revolutionary
> changes intending to deliver redesigned 5.0, to keep going the current road
> improving the codebase, removing the odd stuff like 'Citrix NetScaler',
> 'Juniper XYZ' if nobody supports them, improving current functionality and
> adding new core features which are opensource without vendor lock-in, e.g.
> SDNs (I know Wido is very into it) e.g. Cumulus infra support. I believe
> current codebase is a pretty capable basement for future stable
> functionality.
>
> About new UI, etc stuff... Let's be honest. We develop CloudStack-UI
> project for 1.5 years AFAIK. No single PR from other developers. Next,
> Imagine, you have tree dedicated devs for CS5.X. Ok, it will take two years
> to deliver new UI. Is it possible? NO.
>
> Only gradual improvement can work for the current production team. We need
> to put efforts to broaden the community, delivering the stuff which
> helps new adopters to launch fast, e.g. as simple as Proxmox VE or oVirt or
> VmWare ESXi. New users don't need much top-notch stuff, they need to
> bootstrap fast.
>
>
>
>
> сб, 26 янв. 2019 г. в 04:26, Rafael Weingärtner <rafaelweingartner@gmail.com
>> :
>
>> I am 100% with @Rohit Yadav <rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com> with respect to
>> 4.12. I do diverge regarding the next LTS version though.
>>
>> As you all guys said, the community is small, and as such, if we have the
>> requirement for multiple major changes, before upgrading the "X" bit in a
>> release, we will never go there (that is a fact). In my opinion, because
>> the community is small, we should look for a single major change (e.g. new
>> database upgrade method/scheme), and this should trigger the next major
>> release. The ability to upgrade the "X" bit free us to remove things such
>> as the basic network support (of course, we need to create a migration
>> path), new database scheme management method, normalize log messages and
>> logging framework and so on (many more issues can be listed here).
>>
>> I really do not understand why we have so much resistance from some people
>> on this topic.
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 2:27 PM Suresh Kumar Anaparti <
>> sureshkumar.anaparti@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Sounds good. Altogether, the makeover should be a new user experience and
>>> leverage the latest hypervisor/storage tech and new/redesigned
>> frameworks.
>>>
>>> -Suresh
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 10:13 AM Rohit Yadav <rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm in the favour of keeping the 4.x going because no API compatibility
>>> is
>>>> broken, and as long as we are following semver there is no need.
>> Calling
>>> a
>>>> 4.x a 5.x just for the sake of bumping versions may cause some
>> perception
>>>> issue.
>>>>
>>>> Removal of unsupported/poc/incomplete features, plugins including APIs
>>>> should not constitute breaking of compatibility. Several network and
>>>> hypervisor plugins are still in poc/incomplete/unmaintained state.
>>>>
>>>> Unless the API layer, and perhaps DB layer is re-architected there is
>> no
>>>> point in calling the next version 5.x as long as semver is followed.
>>>>
>>>> In my opinion, the next major version 5.0 should have a restful
>> versioned
>>>> API layer, a new DB+upgrade framework that may support multiple db
>>> servers,
>>>> a new UI, sandboxed plugin framework (right now a plugin can do
>> anything
>>> it
>>>> wants to say the cloud db), a new agent-clustering framework (the
>> current
>>>> low level nio and rpc code goes away), a distributed message bus and
>>>> locking service (that we thought to introduce in 4.2,4.3 but
>> incomplete),
>>>> and refactor the networking/VR layer with a new VR. Not to mention
>>> cleanup
>>>> some technical debt. The keywords being major architectural and
>>>> api/integrational changes. Some of this maybe on-going, but we'll get
>> to
>>>> 5.x with patience over time.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Rohit Yadav
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> From: Ivan Kudryavtsev <kudryavtsev_ia@bw-sw.com>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2019 9:15:29 AM
>>>> To: users; dev
>>>> Subject: Why CloudStack 5
>>>>
>>>> I decided whether to write it several weeks thinking about the stones
>> and
>>>> rotten potatoes, but still decided to do that. Hope it will not raise
>> the
>>>> stress level.
>>>>
>>>> Colleagues and ACS leaders, I would like to initiate the discussion.
>> Why
>>> go
>>>> to CS5 rather than stay with 4.XX. Some thoughts are:
>>>>
>>>> 1. According to the versioning guide, the first number stands for
>> radical
>>>> changes like if the community decided to go from current ORM to
>>> Hibernate.
>>>> I don't see the capabilities for such changes and there are no
>> intentions
>>>> for the implementation.
>>>>
>>>> 2. I can realize that we 'stuck' with '4.XX' and the marketing can be
>>>> disappointing from that point of view. Then, OK, let's just skip the
>>> first
>>>> number "4." and release, ACS 13.X, 14.X, 15.X and so on. Every version
>>> will
>>>> receive new impressing version number and everyone could be happy about
>>>> that.
>>>>
>>>> Going to version "5" currently looks like as an intention to refresh
>> but
>>>> with very poor motivation. At least to me.
>>>>
>>>> The discussion is strongly welcome.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> With best regards, Ivan Kudryavtsev
>>>> Bitworks LLC
>>>> Cell RU: +7-923-414-1515
>>>> Cell USA: +1-201-257-1512
>>>> WWW: http://bitworks.software/ <http://bw-sw.com/>
>>>>
>>>> rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com
>>>> www.shapeblue.com
>>>> Amadeus House, Floral Street, London  WC2E 9DPUK
>>>> @shapeblue
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Rafael Weingärtner
>>
>
>
> --
> With best regards, Ivan Kudryavtsev
> Bitworks LLC
> Cell RU: +7-923-414-1515
> Cell USA: +1-201-257-1512
> WWW: http://bitworks.software/ <http://bw-sw.com/>

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