From dev-return-111583-archive-asf-public=cust-asf.ponee.io@cloudstack.apache.org Tue Jun 19 23:16:43 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Delivered-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by mx-eu-01.ponee.io (Postfix) with SMTP id 50C03180634 for ; Tue, 19 Jun 2018 23:16:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 59629 invoked by uid 500); 19 Jun 2018 21:16:41 -0000 Mailing-List: contact dev-help@cloudstack.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list dev@cloudstack.apache.org Received: (qmail 59618 invoked by uid 99); 19 Jun 2018 21:16:40 -0000 Received: from pnap-us-west-generic-nat.apache.org (HELO spamd4-us-west.apache.org) (209.188.14.142) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 19 Jun 2018 21:16:40 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spamd4-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at spamd4-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTP id 12EDFC012E for ; Tue, 19 Jun 2018 21:16:40 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at spamd4-us-west.apache.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.3 tagged_above=-999 required=6.31 tests=[KAM_LAZY_DOMAIN_SECURITY=1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=disabled Received: from mx1-lw-eu.apache.org ([10.40.0.8]) by localhost (spamd4-us-west.apache.org [10.40.0.11]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id o350rdFg9b4v for ; Tue, 19 Jun 2018 21:16:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from se01-out.mail.pcextreme.nl (se01-out.mail.pcextreme.nl [185.66.251.200]) by mx1-lw-eu.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at mx1-lw-eu.apache.org) with ESMTPS id 723FB5F366 for ; Tue, 19 Jun 2018 21:16:38 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Blocking the creation of new Basic Networking zones To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org, Daan Hoogland References: From: Wido den Hollander Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=wido@widodh.nl; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= xsBNBFPkomgBCADGA8E8Wm2bG2lSTggjk4i6iEHEA6EZJ9Ln2nTIGPg+QbRAZSYuPBtr0d6K kijiFzh0oujoQ5Q6UlK1sp3on7PIsmKeK5K54Ji+is28xPaUAoEVteTb/2XuLon/sobO+fzM v2nrZ63owjQRMUtuR9vJmZ+aODq0WyHUj4bw1WVIL3PBkQ5QuwDA6u5e/UlugvdVf+GMCFOM wOo8mh6IRtYQTqoUkiGydrAM8gFbOTA9rO4bFpbSbiu/e9FbDwdmj370YHFVd6s/wgNtOeKs pQVdWD8tJI8eI8g0L/HYfxD69BTnyI0YPjI1n/aDHRvh0F1usYoTXb2/18pDPNcjVfxvABEB AAHNO1dpZG8gZGVuIEhvbGxhbmRlciAoUENleHRyZW1lIEIuVi4ga2V5KSA8d2lkb0BwY2V4 dHJlbWUubmw+wsB4BBMBAgAiBQJT5KJoAhsDBgsJCAcDAgYVCAIJCgsEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAAK CRB9xvI4O0zu2g9wB/9l6xuaRF1J3gQB7jAg/B2PnOM4KmjoFPMGSMtKs94rLoqmcn5GUD4H JEdSiP5USqh0OnLN6Knb1ZAASWzLOji9QLq+nPI8zjeMXChF2Qf7/qkP75MslH3wBxy16yl2 0yvd7wqZZXbc7vKSkxVMvJdxqf738d+Zc38u0z0cV43h77T3CvxZuEA13WeHK/eHQCXx3sBl zrjfylM0UbIDhntNWe9q5BYtOOQJpfq9t7DQwTQ6m7VFMrFBExP3ZdHIOvFKesrHyGAJLMw+ 8nMeEdWOe9TEsBgmhxny5TJmygNcekuzoaWSknyHn7vwLNSESejs/Vs3/duv/luZWbkpvaq/ zsBNBFPkomgBCACbkn7d8A2z/4691apLM07NyvkXBON7+HPtBm7LFJ2YnVcfc1AaX6d8XVnG s5aKMqaa5+ZVDpvKX0rUE9B8neQQ0UwUaEG8QlSuilBfAbDA1+8NtjIkoo7Vcy0PTJ1kGhgV D4cD98SIT+NpCB0Om9D80O14YP+ES9pkL3XEcixPy7LpLVTVMz2ZH1PXZy/pm7AdSHX/xcKG SctiO2C8jWq0VZdoQSP5hhnf4FOZdhTnp2bZFFgC/5EQ3tTrBMOJiftmOFf5ai5CLffoBRqN 8e8wsVohcdRKEDvMtdKJntncG3pmJIuDMSWQxhM1LrZ7UgeSBbrS+vCdyKplXwdDw/GJABEB AAHCwF8EGAECAAkFAlPkomgCGwwACgkQfcbyODtM7trA2gf/Ydp28gq6PFZZAycM4n4bUQ2p E34E91VBpJZlYGHJWoBbkBgf6eAzkWXZq2sDnnAjxPP9H7RWyPZGH4xRB4U7JdtAD4z46gWT 8qoWvkbwfZlrmxEPkyTIi05msiNYRk6iGOkb5Oob0yp03ROxZRGljiiLzS44BgK9M+n67DxC IlhSiSotHSfljbMUeMj1VXLrmusEw7Dtds5LzON2UZFd/AUJP6zj9GHCpTsvEwacsCdia683 44jzAsFJLduXHdNa9SKlreahe8fGmv8CAtQpD4OuLiDsqzzwkKPI6GAd1MqJQh5AwM0HarPt oDhu3Bo+SVdO5LIKLCmujjBbHZBHIw== Message-ID: Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2018 23:16:35 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 2a00:f10:400:2:425:b2ff:fe00:1c1 X-SpamExperts-Domain: out.pcextreme.nl X-SpamExperts-Username: 2a00:f10:400:2:425:b2ff:fe00:1c1 Authentication-Results: mail.pcextreme.nl; auth=pass smtp.auth=2a00:f10:400:2:425:b2ff:fe00:1c1@out.pcextreme.nl X-SpamExperts-Outgoing-Class: ham X-SpamExperts-Outgoing-Evidence: Combined (0.19) X-Recommended-Action: accept X-Filter-ID: EX5BVjFpneJeBchSMxfU5tMDsiDskiE6TsXcu04RVbd602E9L7XzfQH6nu9C/Fh9KJzpNe6xgvOx q3u0UDjvO8iOFiy1Zh+at7ab+mPudvOPIwKqP3wdNNrgGu66K2bZD9nR0O+wtfYK0OA+InU3MY82 E3JMG0vMoQrTXSx1yJJUuWMbgw8cqaiEYiU4h6vKuFStTh08T0oeZwtAZH96BlZc4vFKugQ4cXG/ tChmagiJ28dfJecEe5JUU5VfJqy1OPVn7GSsvGfPh6kfjrDGsvXnbn8MYmcXrOcevSqxOW12dtF0 yoRN/DWIFYOgFFHDXHDuw9wBfTlei3Qh9u/4watwsFhZQbiUjZEEk3KPT9E9oLDEz6cVLClJUS8A nGbzwhMjyt2MizHRxmPzFR31OWlI7sf9KA6JmgKX5rV3UtAgZbOL9lZUwKN8rvq5cNxL7hvrxtx8 RSEahRoxEsis7is9jbhmYAsbeptIqCbsVZKAdnDtU06FkUB8dxnUnm2p1W2qNxvHQLxpDZfAtxbu px58lcdzviKTtgFmF08S7wHFNPg8jW/KKjOKf5D1njiPASJFC/49WOPBr5nlEUI4xPZyxMjs013J 8vmr2J2lWbPhcg0aJVll1jBcwgEkw7WVhOyGhzlc/+zoeiUiAEhuF8mXD/2j6GaBp+Ni1FEqZgP5 bgEZuCTDoY7frYITUMh5Damc6GXUphwcaKYcKQ7uoLKt4LfywBVzAOij+ikBxTP+m5vT1qivHqNF pFGIZSCRVnG40XaXL8vpmUJbidyd/tM+m4WpRRDP6YzwkAPgQJaacUbr3EK9aORWOjlzcB6xVkxz FC3tpJuYDHwMOMg2XkJsAKiA9ivJRHkQb1UElrg4Ksx+ubesWn6yvAHWjPJ2UV8ShebT8U8Xw9HT DfreWe8DCe1TDbEsIiennjJ7w2q36u70gWU72NdpR746I3juEQPmKICNBnPtF5pas+82Y+Tj9McU g3T72CTbzfHbCB8uxQqVXa31IeUJT63m/Dju3jR5NeVaJQBh0uawl0Cg8oB68hNGWKpHD1Ra9JsV f0s49WfsZKy8Z8+HqR+OsMaynYlgf/oGiG9NGY6rnqleLQvdDBeffeU9kgdGlnWLjSPND2ZZSGkW f4bGKkMWE+mt X-Report-Abuse-To: spam@semaster01.mail.pcextreme.nl On 06/19/2018 11:07 PM, Daan Hoogland wrote: > I like this initiative, and here comes the big but even though I myself > might think it is not valid; Basic zones are there to give a simple start > for new users. If we can give a one-knob start/one page wizard for creating > a shared network in advanced zone with security groups and userdata, great. That would be a UI thing, but it would be a matter of using VLAN isolation and giving in VLAN 0 or 'untagged', because that's basically what Basic Networking does. It plugs the VM on top of usually cloudbr0 (KVM). If you use vlan://untagged for the broadcast_uri in Advanced Networking you get exactly the same result. > And I really fancy this idea. let's make ACS more simple by throwing at as > much code as we can in a gradual and controlled way :+1: I would love to. But I'm a real novice when it comes to the UI though. So that would be something I wouldn't be good at doing. Blocking Basic Networking creation is a few if-statements at the right location and you're done. Wido > > On Tue, Jun 19, 2018 at 10:57 PM, Wido den Hollander wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> We (PCextreme) are a big-time user of Basic Networking and recently >> started to look into Advanced Networking with VLAN isolation and a >> shared network. >> >> This provides (from what we can see) all the features Basic Networking >> provides, like the VR just doing DHCP and UserData while the Hypervisor >> does the Security Grouping. >> >> That made me wonder why we still have Basic Networking. >> >> Dropping all the code would be a big problem for users as you can't >> simply migrate from Basic to Advanced. In theory we found out that it's >> possible by changing the database, but I wouldn't guarantee it works in >> every use-case. So doing this automatically during a upgrade would be >> difficult. >> >> To prevent us from having to maintain the Basic Networking code for ever >> I would like to propose and discuss the matter of preventing the >> creation of new Basic Networking zones. >> >> In the future this can get us rid of a lot of if-else statements in the >> code and it would make testing also easier as we have few things to test. >> >> Most of the development also seems to go in the Advanced Networking >> direction. >> >> We are currently also working on IPv6 in Advanced Shared Networks and >> that's progressing very good as well. >> >> Would this be something to call the 5.0 release where we simplify the >> networking and in the UI/API get rid of Basic Networking while keeping >> it alive for existing users? >> >> Wido >> > > >