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From Ivan Kudryavtsev <>
Subject Re: Call for participation: Issue triaging and PR review/testing
Date Wed, 13 Dec 2017 15:08:04 GMT
Hi, Paul. Thank you for your response. I just still feel that it's a very
risky approach to deliver a new release if community haven't adopted and
tried a previous one because future unidentified regressions are multiplied
to currently unidentified regressions. But, I see it's a trade and
controversity here.

2017-12-13 21:46 GMT+07:00 Paul Angus <>:

> Thanks Rene.
> @Ivan, I understand your concerns. But if 4.10 is unusable, then it will
> never get much production testing.
> The longer between releases, the harder testing and triage becomes.
> By putting a line in the sand for 4.11 and 4.12, and with the desire to
> keep making every release better than the last we can keep moving forward.
>  I think we're all largely in agreement that the process around 4.10 was
> sub-optimal, which is why we've set out clear guidelines that we'd like to
> work to.
> You are correct that there is more to quality than just Marvin tests (or
> at least the current ones), and long term, if community members like
> yourselves and Rene, come up with tests/test structures that push the
> boundaries of CloudStack, then automated testing will only get better.
> For now though, I would suggest that the best way to galvanise the
> community around the manual testing of CloudStack is to have a release
> candidate that everyone can coalesce around.
> Kind regards,
> Paul Angus
> 53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden, London  WC2N 4HSUK
> @shapeblue
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rene Moser []
> Sent: 13 December 2017 12:56
> To: dev <>;
> Subject: Re: Call for participation: Issue triaging and PR review/testing
> Hi all
> On 12/13/2017 05:04 AM, Ivan Kudryavtsev wrote:
> > Hello, devs, users, Rohit. Have a good day.
> >
> > Rohit, you intend to freeze 4.11 on 8 january and, frankly speaking, I
> > see risks here. A major risk is that 4.10 is too buggy and it seems
> > nobody uses it actually right now in production because it's unusable,
> > unfortunately, so we are planning to freeze 4.11 which stands on
> > untested 4.10 with a lot of lacks still undiscovered and not reported.
> > I believe it's a very dangerous way to release one more release with
> > bad quality. Actually, marvin and units don't cover regressions I meet
> > in 4.10. Ok, let's take a look at new one our engineers found today in
> 4.10:
> So, the point is, how do we (users, devs, all) improve quality?
> Marvin is great for smoke testing but CloudStack is dealing with many
> infra vendor components, which are not covered by the tests. How can we
> detect flows not covered by marvin?
> For me, I decided (independent of this discussion) to write integration
> tests in a way one would not expect, not following the "happy path":
> Try to break CloudStack, to make a better CloudStack.
> Put a chaos monkey in your test infra: Shut down storage, kill a host, put
> latency on storage, disable network on hosts, make load on a host.
> read only fs on a cluster wide primary fs. shut down a VR, remove a VR.
> Things that can happen!
> Not surprisingly I use Ansible. It has an extensive amount of modules
> which can be used to battle prove anything of your infra. Ansible playbooks
> are fairly easy to write, even when you are not used to write code.
> I will share my works when ready.
> René

With best regards, Ivan Kudryavtsev
Bitworks Software, Ltd.
Cell: +7-923-414-1515
WWW: <>

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