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From Mike Tutkowski <mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com>
Subject Re: [Propose][New Feature] Storage Snapshots
Date Mon, 08 Feb 2016 18:26:17 GMT
Hi Pierre-Luc,

My recommendation would be this:

Add an "archive" flag to the current volume-snapshot API. Its default would
be "false" because that would be backward compatible with how 4.6 has
volume snapshots implemented (i.e. they stay on the SAN in 4.6, 4.7, and
4.8).

If you set archive=true, then we would perform a background migration of
the snapshot from the SAN to the secondary storage (then delete the SAN
snapshot).

That archive parameter would only be valid for managed storage.

Sound reasonable?

Also, a VM snapshot that includes disks provided by managed storage should
work.

Talk to you later,
Mike

On Mon, Feb 8, 2016 at 9:22 AM, Pierre-Luc Dion <pdion@cloudops.com> wrote:

> Mike,
>
> In terms of API's, would you prefer introducing a parameter to the existing
> VolumeSnapshot, example:   extract={true|false}  with a default value of
> true  which would extract snapshot into the secondary storage, which is the
> current default behavior. Then for SAN snapshot that remain on the SAN we
> would just set "extract=false" ?  as oppose to create a new
>  StorageSnapshot API ?
>
>
> Paul,
>
> From what I'm seeing so far, we can't do a VM-snapshot when using managed
> storage for VM having more than one Volume. For the reason that snapshot
> are performed outside of the hypervisor awareness and asynchronously. If
> someone have a way to address that, it would make thinks much more
> attractive.
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 8, 2016 at 10:57 AM, Ian Rae <irae@cloudops.com> wrote:
>
> > I think a service provider backup scenario is more likely to take
> advantage
> > of SAN snapshot. There are a few reasons for this. Traditional backups
> > involve access to the file system, and there is an expectation that this
> > can be done with reasonably short time frames without negatively
> impacting
> > VM performance, and that the backup orchestrator can apply various logic
> > and or transformations to the data (compress, encrypt, deltas etc...).
> > While it is true that one could apply a backup process to a cloud
> snapshot,
> > this would be slow and inefficient requiring the data to be moved several
> > times and there are some major bottlenecks with cloud snapshots. With a
> > cloud snapshot - there seems to be no reasonable expectation of being
> able
> > to do differential snapshots (I think this depends on the hypervisor) and
> > if you do differential snapshots this will make file backups from those
> > snapshots even more complicated to orchestrate.
> >
> > Suspect there needs to be a different thread on how to better enable
> > backups, as a service. As per Paul's suggestion, but it is a related
> > workflow so relevant to this discussion.
> >
> > Ian
> >
> > On Monday, February 8, 2016, Mike Tutkowski <
> mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > To me it sounds like number two and number three are different uses for
> > the
> > > same "thing"(which is totally fine).
> > >
> > > As for taking a fast SAN snapshot and exporting it asynchronously, do
> we
> > > see the SSVM as performing the export?
> > >
> > > To be backwards compatible with what we have in 4.6 and later for
> volume
> > > snapshots for managed storage, I think it might be easier if we pass
> in a
> > > flag that says whether or not to archive the SAN snapshot (which, I
> > think,
> > > is something that you suggested, as well, Pierre-Luc).
> > >
> > > On Monday, February 8, 2016, Pierre-Luc Dion <pdion@cloudops.com
> > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi Mike,
> > > >
> > > > The reason behind the creation of a SAN snapshot which is exported
> into
> > > > secondary storage, is because creating a copy of the .VHD directly
> > would
> > > > impact uptime of the VM as creating that copy take lots of time. Has
> > > oppose
> > > > to a SAN snapshot that is close to instantaneous which can afterward
> be
> > > > clone into Secondary Storage asynchronously.
> > > >
> > > > I would suspect an extracted VolumeSnapshot taken from a SAN snapshot
> > > could
> > > > have is SAN snapshot deleted to avoid duplica and space consumption
> on
> > > the
> > > > Primary Storage side.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I see 3 definitions in our current discussion regarding the term
> > snapshot
> > > > (these are not official terminology but by own interpretation of
> them):
> > > >
> > > > 1. *Snapshot* (AKA: Storage Snapshot / Mike's definition of a
> > snapshot):
> > > > it's a volume snapshot at the storage level, point in time of your
> > data.
> > > it
> > > > reside on the primary storage. Useful and efficient for software side
> > > > incident.
> > > > 2. *Cloud Snapshot *( AKA: CloudStack VolumeSnapshot/ cloud backup
> > aws-S3
> > > > style ): Point in time copy of the Virtual Disk that reside on a
> > > different
> > > > storage array then the original Volume. Facilitate data migration
> > between
> > > > clusters and, in case of primary storage incident, Volume snapshots
> are
> > > not
> > > > impacted and can be reuse.
> > > > 3. *Backup*: Archival of your Virtual-machines data that also
> validate
> > > data
> > > > integrity, provide a storage efficient archiving method and an
> > > independent
> > > > way to restore your data in case of an major infrastructure disaster.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Regards,
> > > >
> > > > PL
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 1:34 PM, Mike Tutkowski <
> > > > mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > So, let's see if I currently follow the requirements:
> > > > >
> > > > > * Augment volume snapshots for managed storage to conditionally
> > export
> > > > data
> > > > > to NFS. The current process of taking a snapshot on the SAN is
> fine,
> > > but
> > > > > we'd like the option to export the data to NFS, as well.
> > > > >
> > > > > Questions:
> > > > >
> > > > > Once the data has been exported to NFS, do we keep the SAN snapshot
> > or
> > > > > delete it?
> > > > >
> > > > > If we are deleting the SAN snapshot, then why don't we just copy
> the
> > > VHD
> > > > > from primary to secondary the way we do today for non-managed (i.e.
> > > > > traditional) storage? Why create a SAN snapshot in that scenario?
> > > Perhaps
> > > > > to have the SSVM mount and perform the VHD copy to secondary
> storage
> > > > > instead of a XenServer host?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks for the clarification.
> > > > >
> > > > > By the way, to me a backup is when you copy data from one storage
> > > system
> > > > to
> > > > > another (regardless of features, if any, to restore the data in the
> > > > > future). A snapshot is a point-in-time view of the data of a volume
> > and
> > > > > it's stored on the same storage system as the volume.
> > > > >
> > > > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 11:09 AM, Pierre-Luc Dion <
> pdion@cloudops.com
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > <javascript:;>>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > That's fun to see that discussion happening. I 100% agree with
> > Paul's
> > > > > > points of view. VolumeSnapshot are not a backup, but I do
> consider
> > > them
> > > > > as
> > > > > > a safety vest against Primary Storage failure, because failure
> > append
> > > > > :-( .
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The current proposal around snapshots that reside on the primary
> > > > storage
> > > > > or
> > > > > > snapshots that end in the Secondary Storage  is not to address
> any
> > > kind
> > > > > of
> > > > > > backups requirement because a snapshot is not a backup, event an
> > > > > extracted
> > > > > > VM snapshot.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The main idea, and again this is for managed storage;
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 1. StorageSnapshotAPI: Provide storage side snapshot capability
> for
> > > > fast
> > > > > > response time that support rollback to previous timestamp, create
> > new
> > > > > > volume and maybe create template.
> > > > > >     not required to be a new API if the work is already done, I
> > think
> > > > > this
> > > > > > is a different behaviors than the user expectation of a
> > > > volume-snapshot.
> > > > > > 2. VolumeSnapshotAPI: Provide current cloudstack behavior that
> > create
> > > > an
> > > > > > extraction of a volume into SecondaryStorage which can be reuse
> to
> > > > > create a
> > > > > > new volume into another Primary Storage. This type of snapshot
> is a
> > > > slow
> > > > > > job since yes it would have to copy the full volume size on the
> > > > Secondary
> > > > > > storage.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > PL
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 12:45 PM, Syed Mushtaq <
> > > syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com <javascript:;>
> > > > <javascript:;>>
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > I think I share you view on the 'Ideal world'. Backup (via
> Volume
> > > > > > > Snapshots) is a huge bottleneck in Cloudstack. This is
> amplified
> > > > > > especially
> > > > > > > when you have a object storage as your secondary storage
> because
> > it
> > > > > > > requires two copies (one to an NFS staging area and from there
> to
> > > > > object
> > > > > > > storage). And not to mention that all these copies are
> consuming
> > > > > > hypervisor
> > > > > > > resources. Xenserver's Dom0 is also a huge bottleneck as all
> the
> > > > > Network
> > > > > > > and I/O flow through it. So our intention of proposing the
> > "Storage
> > > > > > > Snapshots" is to give a better way of achiving snapshots while
> > > still
> > > > > > > keeping the original definition of volume snpashots (ie upload
> to
> > > sec
> > > > > > > storage).
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > But as Erik pointed out volume snapshots are not backups. They
> > > don't
> > > > > work
> > > > > > > form multi-disk LVM volume groups and dynamic disks. I am all
> in
> > > for
> > > > a
> > > > > > > better backup solution which handles these use cases and
> utilizes
> > > the
> > > > > > > storage's advanced features.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 12:29 PM, Paul Angus <
> > > > paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>
> > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > In the beginning... there were CloudStack snapshots and they
> > were
> > > > > > > actually
> > > > > > > > volume snapshots not hypervisor point-in-time snapshots.
> > > > > > > > Then VM snapshots were created (which are point-in-time
> > > hypervisor
> > > > > > > > snapshots) and we started referring to the original snapshots
> > as
> > > > > volume
> > > > > > > > snapshots.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > CloudStack does not offer 'backups', but many people use
> volume
> > > > > > snapshots
> > > > > > > > as backups. However you can't in-place restore volume
> snapshots
> > > and
> > > > > if
> > > > > > > you
> > > > > > > > have a VM with multiple volumes, the volume snapshots must be
> > > done
> > > > in
> > > > > > > > series, meaning that the state across all of the volumes is
> > > > unlikely
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > be
> > > > > > > > consistent.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > 'Actual Backups' would enable all of the restore options
> which
> > > > users
> > > > > > > might
> > > > > > > > expect as well options as to where they might be stored. In
> my
> > > > ideal
> > > > > > > world
> > > > > > > > they would also be able to leverage back-end hardware (such
> as
> > > > > > Solidfire,
> > > > > > > > NetApp etc :) ) and software such as Veeam, Commvault etc to
> > > > > accelerate
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > process.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > [image: ShapeBlue] <http://www.shapeblue.com>
> > > > > > > > Paul Angus
> > > > > > > > VP Technology ,  ShapeBlue
> > > > > > > > d:  *+44 203 617 0528 | s: +44 203 603 0540*
> > > > > > > >
> <+44%20203%20617%200528%20%7C%20s:%20+44%20203%20603%200540>  |
> > > m:
> > > > > > > > *+44 7711 418784* <+44%207711%20418784>
> > > > > > > > e:  *paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>
> |
> > > t: @cloudyangus*
> > > > > > > > <paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>%20%7C%20t:%20@cloudyangus>
> > > > |  w:
> > > > > > > > *www.shapeblue.com* <http://www.shapeblue.com>
> > > > > > > > a:  53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden London WC2N 4HS UK
> > > > > > > > Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales.
> > > > > ShapeBlue
> > > > > > > > Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is
> > > > operated
> > > > > > > under
> > > > > > > > license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria
> Ltda
> > > is
> > > > a
> > > > > > > > company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license
> > from
> > > > > Shape
> > > > > > > > Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The
> > > > > Republic
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue Ltd.
> > > > > ShapeBlue
> > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > a registered trademark.
> > > > > > > > This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and
> > are
> > > > > > intended
> > > > > > > > solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed.
> > Any
> > > > > views
> > > > > > > or
> > > > > > > > opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not
> > > > > > necessarily
> > > > > > > > represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If
> you
> > > are
> > > > > not
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any
> > > action
> > > > > > based
> > > > > > > > upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please
> > contact
> > > > the
> > > > > > > sender
> > > > > > > > if you believe you have received this email in error.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > > From: Syed Mushtaq [mailto:syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com
> > > <javascript:;> <javascript:;>]
> > > > > > > > Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 4:58 PM
> > > > > > > > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org <javascript:;> <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Propose][New Feature] Storage Snapshots
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Paul,
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > When you say actual backups, how would it be different from
> the
> > > > > Volume
> > > > > > > > Snapshots that exist currently. My understanding is that
> > Backups
> > > > end
> > > > > up
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > Sec Storage whereas Snapshots are just a point-in-time state
> of
> > > > your
> > > > > > > volume
> > > > > > > > which can be restored back correct?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > -Syed
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 11:23 AM, Paul Angus <
> > > > > paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>
> > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Hi Syed,
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > As I understand it, the SolidFire plugin will export the
> > > snapshot
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > secondary storage if the user requests a template from the
> > > > snapshot
> > > > > > or
> > > > > > > > > wants to download the snapshot from the cloud. This is a
> > good,
> > > > > > > > > pragmatic approach and yes Mike the SolidFire storage is
> > super
> > > > > > > > > reliable and snapshots on SolidFire arrays take up next to
> no
> > > > > space.
> > > > > > > > > BUT I think that we are talking about a more general
> purpose
> > > API,
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > other storage systems may not be as awesome as Mike's.
> That's
> > > my
> > > > > > > > > concern. Also, the time to transfer for say 1TB to move
> from
> > > > > primary
> > > > > > > > > to sec storage and then create a VM template out of it may
> be
> > > too
> > > > > > long
> > > > > > > > for users.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > @Mike I don’t think 'we' use the term volume snapshot for
> > > backup,
> > > > > > it's
> > > > > > > > > just that users want to do backups and a volume snapshot is
> > the
> > > > > only
> > > > > > > > > type of snapshot that copies the disk elsewhere and can be
> > > > > scheduled.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I'm 'pondering' the implications of enabling actual backups
> > > > > (through
> > > > > > > > > recognised backup providers) and the user requirements
> around
> > > > them
> > > > > > > > > (particularly restoration use cases) as a separate thread
> of
> > > > work.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > [image: ShapeBlue] <http://www.shapeblue.com> Paul Angus
> VP
> > > > > > Technology
> > > > > > > > > , ShapeBlue
> > > > > > > > > d: *+44 203 617 0528 | s: +44 203 603 0540*
> > > > > > > > >
> <+44%20203%20617%200528%20%7C%20s:%20+44%20203%20603%200540>
> > |
> > > m:
> > > > > > > > > *+44 7711 418784* <+44%207711%20418784>
> > > > > > > > > e: *paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;>
> <javascript:;> |
> > > t: @cloudyangus*
> > > > > > > > > <paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>
> > > > %20%7C%20t:%20@cloudyangus> | w:
> > > > > > > > > *www.shapeblue.com* <http://www.shapeblue.com>
> > > > > > > > > a: 53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden London WC2N 4HS UK Shape
> > > Blue
> > > > > Ltd
> > > > > > > > > is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue
> > > Services
> > > > > > India
> > > > > > > > > LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated
> under
> > > > > license
> > > > > > > > > from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is
> a
> > > > > company
> > > > > > > > > incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from
> > Shape
> > > > > Blue
> > > > > > > > > Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The
> > > Republic
> > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue
> Ltd.
> > > > > > > > > ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.
> > > > > > > > > This email and any attachments to it may be confidential
> and
> > > are
> > > > > > > > > intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is
> > > > > > addressed.
> > > > > > > > > Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the
> > author
> > > > and
> > > > > do
> > > > > > > > > not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or
> related
> > > > > > > > > companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this
> > email,
> > > > you
> > > > > > > > > must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor
> > copy
> > > or
> > > > > > show
> > > > > > > > > it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you
> > have
> > > > > > > received
> > > > > > > > this email in error.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > > > From: Syed Mushtaq [mailto:syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > <javascript:;>]
> > > > > > > > > Sent: 05 February 2016 15:31
> > > > > > > > > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org <javascript:;>
> <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Propose][New Feature] Storage Snapshots
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I think the terminology confusion comes from AWS where they
> > do
> > > > EBS
> > > > > > > > > snapshots backed up to S3 and CloudStack sort of followed
> > that.
> > > > And
> > > > > > as
> > > > > > > > > an end user who is oblivious to the internals of my
> provider,
> > > my
> > > > > > > > > expectation would be something similar to what AWS as that
> is
> > > my
> > > > > > > > > biggest reference point.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > To your point Mike, I agree that a Primary Storage failure
> on
> > > > > > > > > SolidFire is unlikely, there are other motivations for us
> to
> > > push
> > > > > > data
> > > > > > > > > to secondary storage. Primary storage (atleast for us)
> costs
> > > > > around 3
> > > > > > > > > times as much as secondary storage and snapshots on primary
> > > > storage
> > > > > > > > > are rarely used (especially for some of our customers who
> do
> > > > daily
> > > > > > > > backups).
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 10:18 AM, Mike Tutkowski <
> > > > > > > > > mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> <javascript:;>>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Some of the weirdness is around terminology.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > For most systems I've worked on, a snapshot and a backup
> > are
> > > > two
> > > > > > > > > > completely different things (but CloudStack has
> > traditionally
> > > > > used
> > > > > > > > > > the term "volume snapshot" to mean backup).
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I will put in a SolidFire "plug" here and say, though,
> that
> > > if
> > > > > your
> > > > > > > > > > primary storage is running on SolidFire that it is
> unlikely
> > > > > you'll
> > > > > > > > > > encounter an issue where your primary storage goes
> offline
> > > (and
> > > > > > > > > > you'll even maintain your performance guarantees during
> > > failure
> > > > > > > > > > scenarios and upgrades, as well). That being the case, it
> > is
> > > > less
> > > > > > > > > > useful to require a backup to Swift (but it's perfectly
> OK
> > if
> > > > > > that's
> > > > > > > > > > what we want to do
> > > > > > > > > here).
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 8:07 AM, Syed Mushtaq
> > > > > > > > > > <syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>
> > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Paul,
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I believe with the current implementation of Snapshots
> on
> > > > > managed
> > > > > > > > > > > storage
> > > > > > > > > > > (SolidFire) the snapshots are never exported to the
> > > secondary
> > > > > > > > storage.
> > > > > > > > > > > While this solves the problem of having snapshots
> taking
> > > > > forever
> > > > > > > > > > > to get to sec storage, this leaves us with a
> > > > > > > > > > huge
> > > > > > > > > > > liability if our primary storage goes down. We see
> > > snapshots
> > > > as
> > > > > > > > > > > our recovery path because we store them in Swift which
> is
> > > > > > reliable
> > > > > > > > > > > and resilient to failures.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > With Storage snpashots our goal is to have Volume
> > snapshots
> > > > > > always
> > > > > > > > > > > backed up to secondary storage and Storage Snapshots
> stay
> > > on
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > primary
> > > > > > > > > > storage.
> > > > > > > > > > > A provider could potentially mix both these and solve
> the
> > > > > problem
> > > > > > > > > > > that you mentioned where you want to meet user's
> > > expectation
> > > > > of a
> > > > > > > > > > > snapshot (ie backup to sec storage) while having an
> > ability
> > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > utilize faster sanpshots (i.e. on the device)
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Hope this clarifies things.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > > > -Syed
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 9:04 AM, Paul Angus
> > > > > > > > > > > <paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;>
> <javascript:;>>
> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > HI guys,
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Could someone point me to the Jira bug of FS for the
> > > > > > > > > > > > SAN-snapshot
> > > > > > > > > > feature
> > > > > > > > > > > > in 4.6 which is mentioned.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > From my discussions with users and operators around
> > > > snapshots
> > > > > > > > > > > > I'd make
> > > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > following observations:
> > > > > > > > > > > > a. 'users' use snapshots as backups (both long-term
> and
> > > > short
> > > > > > > > > > > > term)
> > > > > > > > > > with
> > > > > > > > > > > > the expectation that they can use them for recovery
> if
> > > > > > required.
> > > > > > > > > > > > b. operators fall back to snapshots if something has
> > gone
> > > > > wrong
> > > > > > > > > > > > with primary storage.
> > > > > > > > > > > > c. users sometimes want to be able to export
> snapshots
> > as
> > > > > well
> > > > > > > > > > > > as
> > > > > > > > > > create
> > > > > > > > > > > > new VMs from their snapshots
> > > > > > > > > > > > d. snapshots are a currently a massive pain for
> > > operators,
> > > > I
> > > > > > > > > > > > know at
> > > > > > > > > > > least
> > > > > > > > > > > > one public cloud who have snapshots which take 2 days
> > to
> > > > > > > complete.
> > > > > > > > > > > > e. snapshots (as they are) can't be used for multiple
> > LVM
> > > > > > disks.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > I think the process Mike has used in the SolidFire
> > plugin
> > > > > (only
> > > > > > > > > > > > moving
> > > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > disk image to secondary storage when you absolutely
> > have
> > > > to)
> > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > > > a very
> > > > > > > > > > > good
> > > > > > > > > > > > and pragmatic solution. I wonder what problems an
> > > operator
> > > > > > might
> > > > > > > > > > > experience
> > > > > > > > > > > > if they have an issue with a given primary storage
> pool
> > > in
> > > > a
> > > > > > > > cluster.
> > > > > > > > > > (I
> > > > > > > > > > > > know that that is REALLY unlikely in the SolidFire
> case
> > > > Mike
> > > > > :)
> > > > > > > > > > > > ) And
> > > > > > > > > > if
> > > > > > > > > > > > the transfer from primary to secondary is slow, the
> > time
> > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > > being able
> > > > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > > create a template or export the volume will be slow.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > So for me the issue is around making sure that the
> end
> > > > users
> > > > > > > > > > expectations
> > > > > > > > > > > > are met (while improving the speed/efficiency of the
> > back
> > > > > end)
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > [image: ShapeBlue] <http://www.shapeblue.com> Paul
> > Angus
> > > > VP
> > > > > > > > > > > > Technology , ShapeBlue
> > > > > > > > > > > > d: *+44 203 617 0528 | s: +44 203 603 0540*
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > <+44%20203%20617%200528%20%7C%20s:%20+44%20203%20603%200540>
> > > > > |
> > > > > > m:
> > > > > > > > > > > > *+44 7711 418784* <+44%207711%20418784>
> > > > > > > > > > > > e: *paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;> | t:
> > > > @cloudyangus*
> > > > > > > > > > > > <paul.angus@shapeblue.com <javascript:;>
> > <javascript:;>
> > > > %20%7C%20t:%20@cloudyangus> | w:
> > > > > > > > > > > > *www.shapeblue.com* <http://www.shapeblue.com>
> > > > > > > > > > > > a: 53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden London WC2N 4HS UK
> > > Shape
> > > > > > Blue
> > > > > > > > > > > > Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales.
> > > ShapeBlue
> > > > > > > > > > > > Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India
> > and
> > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > > > operated
> > > > > > > > > > > under
> > > > > > > > > > > > license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil
> > > Consultoria
> > > > > Ltda
> > > > > > > > > > > > is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated
> > under
> > > > > > > > > > > > license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is
> a
> > > > > company
> > > > > > > > > > > > registered by The Republic
> > > > > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > > > > South Africa and is traded under license from Shape
> > Blue
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> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > > > > > > From: Pierre-Luc Dion [mailto:pdion@cloudops.com
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > <javascript:;>]
> > > > > > > > > > > > Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 12:56 PM
> > > > > > > > > > > > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Propose][New Feature] Storage Snapshots
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Mike,
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > The idea of introducing a new API: StorageSnapshot
> for
> > > > > managed
> > > > > > > > > > > > storage
> > > > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > > > because the VolumeSnapshot default, or expected,
> > behavior
> > > > is
> > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > > archive snapshots into the Secondary Storage. So a
> > > > > > > > > > > > StorageSnapshot API would be
> > > > > > > > > > > for
> > > > > > > > > > > > snapshot that remain on the managed storage
> appliance.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Quickly looking at the API doc and I don't see a
> strong
> > > > > > > > > > > > requirement for volume snapshots to be moved into
> > > secondary
> > > > > > > > > > > > storage. So, maybe StorageSnapshot API is not useful,
> > but
> > > > > both
> > > > > > > > > > > > use cases are required. A snapshot that remain on the
> > > > managed
> > > > > > > > > > > > storage, and another type of
> > > > > > > > > > snapshot
> > > > > > > > > > > > that end up into the secondary storage. Since you've
> > > done a
> > > > > lot
> > > > > > > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > > work,
> > > > > > > > > > > > might easier to just add a parameter to the current
> > > > snapshot
> > > > > > API
> > > > > > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > > would
> > > > > > > > > > > > trigger an extraction of the storage snapshot into
> the
> > > > > > secondary
> > > > > > > > > > storage?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > PL
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 9:02 PM, Mike Tutkowski <
> > > > > > > > > > > > mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > I think that all sounds reasonable then - thanks!
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 6:52 PM, Syed Mushtaq <
> > > > > > > > > > syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> You are correct Mike in terms of the requirements.
> > One
> > > > of
> > > > > > our
> > > > > > > > > > earlier
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> iterations on this was to have an argument to the
> > > create
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> snapshot
> > > > > > > > > > API
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> which decides whether to backup the volume to sec
> > > > storage
> > > > > > but
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> we realized it would make management of snapshots
> > > quite
> > > > > > messy
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> so we proposed a new api instead.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016, 8:29 PM Mike Tutkowski
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> <mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Hi,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Just to make sure I understand all the
> requirements
> > > > here:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> 1) This relates only to managed storage (1:1
> > mapping
> > > > > > between
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> a virtual disk and a backend SAN volume).
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> 2) We want to take the current (introduced in
> 4.6)
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> functionality, which creates a snapshot on the
> SAN,
> > > and
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> extend it via a config option (or
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> something) to not only take the SAN snapshot, but
> > to
> > > > copy
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> the underlying VHD (XenServer only) to NFS.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> 3) The SAN snapshot is always taken. It's the
> > backup
> > > to
> > > > > NFS
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> that is optional.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> 4) Templates can be created from the snapshot
> > that's
> > > on
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> SAN (already works).
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> 5) CloudStack volumes can be created from the
> > > snapshot
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> that's on
> > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> SAN (already works as long as the new CloudStack
> > > volume
> > > > > > ends
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> up on the same primary storage).
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Would we have a need for a storage snapshot API
> > then
> > > or
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> would that just be the standard volume snapshot
> > > without
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> backup to
> > > > > > > > > NFS?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Thanks!
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Mike
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 5:24 PM, Syed Mushtaq
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> <syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Is it possible to have both functionalities
> > > (snapshot
> > > > on
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> SAN & Sec
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Storage) coexist? Because Ideally, we would like
> > to
> > > > have
> > > > > > > both.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> For example, some of our customers want to
> > implement
> > > > > their
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> own backup strategies and do encryption to their
> > > > backups
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> which is a perfect use case for Storage Snapshot
> > > while
> > > > > our
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> other customers will still keep using the
> standard
> > > > > volume
> > > > > > > > > snapshot.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> To keep things backward compatible, we can add a
> > > > setting
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> which
> > > > > > > > > > says
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> to not upload on secondary storage, because,
> after
> > > > all,
> > > > > > you
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> would take a SAN snapshot first when doing a
> > Volume
> > > > > > > Snapshot.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> You could stop the process there and not do the
> > > > upload.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> What do you think about this approach?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> -Syed
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 4:25 PM, Mike Tutkowski <
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>> mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> So, this is just me thinking out load here, but
> > if
> > > a
> > > > > > given
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> CloudStack cloud doesn't actually need to
> provide
> > > > both
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > ability
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> to take a SAN snapshot and export it to NFS (if
> > > just
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> taking a SAN snapshot is OK), then we might be
> > able
> > > > to
> > > > > > get
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> away with no new
> > > > > > > > > > API
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> calls and simply implement a new custom
> snapshot
> > > > > strategy
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> and
> > > > > > > > > > data
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> motion strategy to handle the case where the
> > > > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> cloud
> > > > > > > > > > does
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> want both a SAN snapshot and exported-to-NFS
> > > backup.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> In other words, the "default" behavior would be
> > to
> > > > use
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> snapshot strategy and data motion strategy that
> > we
> > > > > > already
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> have (the one that only takes a SAN snapshot).
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> If your CloudStack cloud, however, wants to
> take
> > a
> > > > SAN
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> snapshot and have the data exported to NFS,
> then
> > we
> > > > > could
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> have you manipulate a Swing config file to make
> > use
> > > > of
> > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> new snapshot strategy and data motion strategy
> > that
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> performs both of these
> > > > > > > > > > > > activities.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> This way, the old behavior is still the default
> > for
> > > > > > users,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> but CloudStack admins can change this behavior
> > via
> > > > > > > > > configuration.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Thoughts?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 11:55 AM, Mike
> Tutkowski <
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Right...I think we will need to come up with a
> > > > viable
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> upgrade path or some reasonable way for them
> to
> > > move
> > > > > > from
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> the old way to the new way (and some obvious
> way
> > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> they will know they need
> > > > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > > > do this).
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 11:45 AM, Syed Mushtaq
> <
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I'm not really sure about the upgrade path
> > > however,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> customers who are using 4.6 and are on a
> > managed
> > > > > > storage
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> would no longer have the same functionality
> > with
> > > > > Volume
> > > > > > > > > Snapshots.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 1:43 PM, Syed Mushtaq
> <
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> So if I understand correctly, currently
> > taking a
> > > > > > Volume
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Snapshots of a volume on a managed storage
> > keeps
> > > > it
> > > > > on
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the storage array. As a part of this
> feature,
> > we
> > > > can
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> make sure
> > > > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Volume Snapshots on managed storage are
> > uploaded
> > > > to
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> secondary storage. This would make the
> Volume
> > > > > Snapshot
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> feature behave the same regardless of the
> > > storage
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> (managed or
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> non-managed) And, for utilizing the
> efficient
> > > > > backend
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> storage
> > > > > > > > > > > > capabilities, we can use the new storage snapshots
> API.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 1:36 PM, Mike
> > Tutkowski <
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Hi everyone,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Whatever we do here, we need to have a plan
> > to
> > > > deal
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> with the fact that we already have a
> feature
> > > (in
> > > > > 4.6
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> and
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> later) that allows you to use the existing
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> volume-snapshot APIs to create a volume
> > > snapshot
> > > > > (for
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> managed
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> storage) that resides on a backend SAN
> > (using a
> > > > > > custom
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> snapshot strategy and a custom data motion
> > > > > strategy).
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> If these new APIs go in, then how should
> the
> > > > > original
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> implementation (present in 4.6 and later)
> be
> > > > > changed?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> If it
> > > > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> changed, how do we support customers who
> are
> > > > > already
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> using
> > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> original volume-snapshot API to take
> > snapshots
> > > > on a
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> backend
> > > > > > > > > > > SAN?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Mike
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 11:27 AM, Will
> > Stevens <
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> wstevens@cloudops.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Will you be able to create a Template
> from a
> > > > > > > > > > StorageSnapshot?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> If yes, will the template be stored in the
> > > > > secondary
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> storage like normal templates or will that
> > be
> > > > > > handled
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> somehow on the
> > > > > > > > > > > > vendor side?
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> *Will STEVENS*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Lead Developer
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> *CloudOps* *| *Cloud Solutions Experts
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 420 rue Guy *|* Montreal *|* Quebec *|*
> H3J
> > > 1S6
> > > > w
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> cloudops.com *|* tw @CloudOps_
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 1:22 PM, Syed
> > Mushtaq <
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> syed1.mushtaq@gmail.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Thanks Will!!!
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 1:19 PM, Will
> > Stevens
> > > <
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> wstevens@cloudops.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I explicitly linked the Design Spec in
> the
> > > > Jira
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> ticket because it was not clear in the
> > > > 'mention'
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> section because it shows as a page 'you
> do
> > > not
> > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > permission to'.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> *Will STEVENS*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Lead Developer
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> *CloudOps* *| *Cloud Solutions Experts
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> 420 rue Guy *|* Montreal *|* Quebec *|*
> > H3J
> > > > 1S6
> > > > > w
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> cloudops.com *|* tw @CloudOps_
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 1:02 PM, Syed
> Ahmed
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> <sahmed@cloudops.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Design Spec:
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > >
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Sto
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> rageSnapshot++API
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Jira Ticket
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CLOUDSTACK-9
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 27
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 8
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi All,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> We plan to propose a new set of APIs to
> > do
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> snapshots on managed storage backends
> > like
> > > > > > > SolidFire.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Snapshots on current managed storage
> stay
> > > on
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> device which is contrary to what
> > CloudStack
> > > > > calls
> > > > > > > > > snpshots.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> But taking snapshots on storage and
> > keeping
> > > > it
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> there has its own advantages
> > > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> we would ideally like to have both ways
> > of
> > > > > doing
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> snapshots. This proposal adds 4 new
> APIs
> > to
> > > > > > create
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> snapshots on backend storage.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> What do you guys think of this
> feature? I
> > > > would
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> love to have some feedback. I am
> working
> > on
> > > > > > making
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the design
> > > > > > > > > > spec
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> more concrete but wanted to have a high
> > > level
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> feedback first before starting to work
> on
> > > it.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> -Syed
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> --
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire
> Inc.*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> > <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> o: 303.746.7302
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> <
> > > > > http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play
> > > > > > >*™
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> *
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> --
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> o: 303.746.7302
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> <
> > > http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play
> > > > > >*™*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> --
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> o: 303.746.7302
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>> <
> > > http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play
> > > > > >*™*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> --
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> *Mike Tutkowski*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> o: 303.746.7302
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> <
> > http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play
> > > > >*™*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > > > > *Mike Tutkowski*
> > > > > > > > > > > > > *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> > > > > > > > > > > > > e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > o: 303.746.7302
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
> > > > > > > > > > > > > <
> http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play
> > > >*™*
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of
> > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > > > > > related
> > > > > > > > > > > services:
> > > > > > > > > > > > IaaS Cloud Design & Build
> > > > > > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//>
> |
> > > > > > CSForge –
> > > > > > > > > > > > rapid IaaS deployment framework <
> > > > > http://shapeblue.com/csforge/
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > CloudStack Consulting
> > > > > > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/> |
> > > > > > > > > > > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > > > > > Software Engineering
> > > > > > > > > > > > <
> http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/
> > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > CloudStack Infrastructure Support
> > > > > > > > > > > > <
> > http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/
> > > >
> > > > |
> > > > > > > > > > > > CloudStack Bootcamp Training Courses
> > > > > > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > > *Mike Tutkowski*
> > > > > > > > > > *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> > > > > > > > > > e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > <javascript:;>
> > > > > > > > > > o: 303.746.7302
> > > > > > > > > > Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
> > > > > > > > > > <http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>*™*
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack
> > > related
> > > > > > > > services:
> > > > > > > > > IaaS Cloud Design & Build
> > > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//> |
> > > CSForge –
> > > > > > rapid
> > > > > > > > > IaaS deployment framework <http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
> > > > > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > > Consulting <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/>
> |
> > > > > > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > > Software Engineering
> > > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
> > > > > > > > > CloudStack Infrastructure Support
> > > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/>
> |
> > > > > > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > > Bootcamp Training Courses <
> > > > > http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack
> > related
> > > > > > > services:
> > > > > > > > IaaS Cloud Design & Build
> > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//> |
> > CSForge –
> > > > > rapid
> > > > > > > > IaaS deployment framework <http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
> > > > > > > > CloudStack Consulting <
> > > > http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/>
> > > > > |
> > > > > > > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > Software Engineering
> > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
> > > > > > > > CloudStack Infrastructure Support
> > > > > > > > <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/> |
> > > > > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > Bootcamp Training Courses <
> > > > http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > *Mike Tutkowski*
> > > > > *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> > > > > e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>
> > > > > o: 303.746.7302
> > > > > Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
> > > > > <http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>*™*
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > *Mike Tutkowski*
> > > *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> > > e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com <javascript:;>
> > > o: 303.746.7302
> > > Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
> > > <http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>*™*
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Ian Rae
> > CEO | PDG
> > c: 514.944.4008
> >
> > CloudOps | Cloud Infrastructure and Networking Solutions
> > www.cloudops.com | 420 rue Guy | Montreal | Canada | H3J 1S6
> >
>



-- 
*Mike Tutkowski*
*Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
o: 303.746.7302
Advancing the way the world uses the cloud
<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>*™*

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