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From Adrian Lewis <adr...@alsiconsulting.co.uk>
Subject RE: CentOS Cloud SIG effort
Date Thu, 02 Apr 2015 13:46:09 GMT
Hi Lucian,

This is still a very devops/developer centric approach which in my opinion
is rife within the ACS community (understandably) and which is inadvertently
hostile/elitist to many who might otherwise be interested. I think that many
regular sys admins who perhaps don't want to get involved with docker,
github, compiling stuff, running 3rd party provisioning scripts etc and just
want to run up a quick POC would end up being alienated by this - they don’t
have the time to learn these sorts of technologies if they would never use
them otherwise. Obviously to most of the audience in this list that's not
the case but I really think that there are a lot of potential (albeit likely
small) deployments out there where the admins run a mile if getting
something to work involves the word 'git' or even 'mailing-list'. These
people just go out and buy vCloud Director instead or do without. Citrix
would probably get more customers for CloudPlatform as well if it were very
simple to try out ACS.

ACS needs hobbyists and sys admins in SMBs as well in my opinion, not just
devops people in large corporations or service providers. More people
playing with it and in turn talking/blogging about it and raising its
profile will help immensely. These people need to be convinced that
#Cloudstackworks.

Get packages into Debian/Ubuntu and there's an even greater audience. Grab
the long tail and the rest of the beast comes with it.

Just my opinion btw - perhaps I'm too old-fashioned and need to learn more.

Adrian

-----Original Message-----
From: Nux! [mailto:nux@li.nux.ro]
Sent: 02 April 2015 13:01
To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
Cc: sebgoa; Paul Angus
Subject: Re: CentOS Cloud SIG effort

Hi Adrian

> Pretty sure that if getting the management server up and running was
> as simple as...
> 1. Install CentOS
> 2. yum install cloudstack
> 3. setup-cloudstack-all-in-one.sh
> ...we'd see many more people at least trying it out.
>
> Some might see the current installation options as easy enough but if
> someone could get it up and running without even looking at the docs,
> I reckon they'd be more likely to do it and then consult the docs when
> they got stuck.

This reminds me of https://github.com/thehyperadvisor/cldstk-deploy , though
there could certainly more/better ideas on how to ease things up, at least
for a PoC.
I'm sure Sebastien will quickly propose docker. :)

>
> If the packages could be put into the centos-extras repo that would do
> the trick. I'm sure there's more to it than my simplistic idea but
> could we discuss the viability of this?

I think this will be difficult to achieve, though I am short on proper
details, I believe the way we (in cloudstack) ship some stuff - particularly
java stuff - is not exactly kosher from a RedHat packaging point of view.
They have their own routine, practices and so on. Furthermore, let's say we
get that right, keeping it up to date in their repo will also be quite an
effort.
I think the idea is good and in an ideal world it's how we'd do it, but
right now with the release cadence of Cloudstack and our few resources, it's
something that - simply - it's not worth doing.

> We could do with a one-stop script that does everything for the user
> including installing the mysql/mariadb server aspect & even setting up
> NFS shares on the same box (leaving the other more granular setup
> scripts for 'advanced' users. If centos-extras is not feasible, how
> about EPEL? Might even get some Fedora people interested as well (if
> it works on Fedora).

See the ansible link I gave above.
Re EPEL and Fedora, they're having trouble maintaining their own stuff, i.e.
they removed openstack from there and are maintaining separate repositories
at https://repos.fedorapeople.org/repos/openstack/

>
> Pretty sure that this particular CentOS SIG is about running the
> management/infrastructure side of things as opposed to running centos
> as a guest in case anyone is unsure. Although clearly related, earlier
> comments about cloud-init are surely more related to another CentOS
> SIG (Cloud
> Instance) aren't they?

Yep, CentOS Cloud Instance SIG is a different project meant to get CentOS
running on all major cloud platforms. This one is somehow successful in that
their official image will boot in Cloudstack and get a ssh key if one is
set, even execute user data, but there are many bugs and other problems. Far
from ideal; it would be great if someone with python skills would take up
polishing the cloud-init Cloudstack source a bit, perhaps as part of GSoC.

My stance on all this is, bother less with packaging or inclusion in CentOS
official repos and focus more on getting it to work as smoothly as possible.

Also, attending the CentOS events with presentations on Cloudstack is a
great idea to raise some awareness.

/imho

Lucian

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