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From Stephen Turner <Stephen.Tur...@citrix.com>
Subject RE: CloudStack Quality Process
Date Wed, 07 Jan 2015 08:50:42 GMT
17:00 - 18:00 GMT, right?

-- 
Stephen Turner


-----Original Message-----
From: Animesh Chaturvedi [mailto:animesh.chaturvedi@citrix.com] 
Sent: 07 January 2015 06:04
To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: RE: CloudStack Quality Process

We can use the following GTM for tomorrow's session


1.  Please join my meeting.
https://www1.gotomeeting.com/join/411279368

2.  Use your microphone and speakers (VoIP) - a headset is recommended.  Or, call in using your telephone.

United States: +1 (571) 317-3129
Argentina (toll-free): 0 800 266 1382
Australia (toll-free): 1 800 193 385
Australia: +61 2 8355 1020
Austria (toll-free): 0 800 202148
Austria: +43 (0) 7 2088 1047
Bahrain (toll-free): 800 81 111
Belarus (toll-free): 8 820 0011 0214
Belgium (toll-free): 0 800 81385
Belgium: +32 (0) 28 08 4368
Brazil (toll-free): 0 800 047 4906
Bulgaria (toll-free): 00800 120 4417
Canada (toll-free): 1 888 455 1389
Canada: +1 (647) 497-9353
Chile (toll-free): 800 395 150
China (toll-free): 4008 811084
Colombia (toll-free): 01 800 012 9054
Czech Republic (toll-free): 800 500448
Denmark (toll-free): 8090 1924
Denmark: +45 (0) 69 91 89 28
Finland (toll-free): 0 800 94507
Finland: +358 (0) 942 59 7850
France (toll-free): 0 805 541 047
France: +33 (0) 170 950 594
Germany (toll-free): 0 800 184 4222
Germany: +49 (0) 692 5736 7317
Greece (toll-free): 00 800 4414 3838
Hong Kong (toll-free): 30713169
Hungary (toll-free): (06) 80 986 255
Iceland (toll-free): 800 9869
India (toll-free): 000 800 100 7855
Indonesia (toll-free): 007 803 011 0395
Ireland (toll-free): 1 800 946 538
Ireland: +353 (0) 19 030 010
Israel (toll-free): 1 809 212 875
Italy (toll-free): 800 906959
Italy: +39 0 247 92 13 01
Japan (toll-free): 0 120 663 800
Korea, Republic of (toll-free): 0806150880 Luxembourg (toll-free): 800 22104 Malaysia (toll-free): 1 800 81 6851 Mexico (toll-free): 01 800 925 0372 Netherlands (toll-free): 0 800 265 8469
Netherlands: +31 (0) 208 080 219
New Zealand (toll-free): 0 800 47 0011
New Zealand: +64 (0) 9 280 6302
Norway (toll-free): 800 69 046
Norway: +47 75 80 32 07
Panama (toll-free): 00 800 226 8832
Peru (toll-free): 0 800 54682
Philippines (toll-free): 1 800 1651 0716 Poland (toll-free): 00 800 1213979 Portugal (toll-free): 800 784 461 Romania (toll-free): 0 800 410 029 Russian Federation (toll-free): 810 800 29674011 Saudi Arabia (toll-free): 800 844 3633 Singapore (toll-free): 800 101 2992 South Africa (toll-free): 0 800 983 867 Spain (toll-free): 800 900 582
Spain: +34 911 82 9906
Sweden (toll-free): 020 980 772
Sweden: +46 (0) 852 500 186
Switzerland (toll-free): 0 800 740 393
Switzerland: +41 (0) 435 0167 13
Taiwan (toll-free): 0 800 666 854
Thailand (toll-free): 001 800 658 131
Turkey (toll-free): 00 800 4488 23683
Ukraine (toll-free): 0 800 50 0641
United Arab Emirates (toll-free): 800 044 40439 United Kingdom (toll-free): 0 808 168 0229 United Kingdom: +44 (0) 330 221 0088 United States (toll-free): 1 877 309 2073 Uruguay (toll-free): 000 413 598 4110 Viet Nam (toll-free): 120 32 153

Access Code: 411-279-368
Audio PIN: Shown after joining the meeting

Meeting ID: 411-279-368

GoToMeeting®
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Not at your computer? Click the link to join this meeting from your iPhone®, iPad® or Android® device via the GoToMeeting app.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stephen Turner [mailto:Stephen.Turner@citrix.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2014 7:41 AM
> To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: RE: CloudStack Quality Process
> 
> I've set up a GTM for this meeting.
> 
> 1.  Please join my meeting.
> https://www1.gotomeeting.com/join/759444232
> 
> 2.  Use your microphone and speakers (VoIP) - a headset is 
> recommended.  Or, call in using your telephone.
> 
> United States: +1 (646) 749-3129
> Argentina (toll-free): 0 800 266 1382
> Australia (toll-free): 1 800 193 385
> Australia: +61 2 8355 1020
> Austria (toll-free): 0 800 202148
> Austria: +43 (0) 7 2088 1047
> Bahrain (toll-free): 800 81 111
> Belarus (toll-free): 8 820 0011 0214
> Belgium (toll-free): 0 800 26116
> Belgium: +32 (0) 28 08 4368
> Brazil (toll-free): 0 800 047 4906
> Bulgaria (toll-free): 00800 120 4417
> Canada (toll-free): 1 888 455 1389
> Canada: +1 (647) 497-9353
> Chile (toll-free): 800 395 150
> China (toll-free): 4008 811084
> Colombia (toll-free): 01 800 012 9054
> Czech Republic (toll-free): 800 500448 Denmark (toll-free): 8090 1924
> Denmark: +45 (0) 69 91 89 28
> Finland (toll-free): 0 800 94507
> Finland: +358 (0) 942 59 7850
> France (toll-free): 0 805 541 047
> France: +33 (0) 170 950 594
> Germany (toll-free): 0 800 723 5270
> Germany: +49 (0) 692 5736 7317
> Greece (toll-free): 00 800 4414 3838
> Hong Kong (toll-free): 30713169
> Hungary (toll-free): (06) 80 986 255
> Iceland (toll-free): 800 9869
> India (toll-free): 000 800 100 7855
> Indonesia (toll-free): 007 803 011 0395 Ireland (toll-free): 1 800 946 
> 538
> Ireland: +353 (0) 19 030 010
> Israel (toll-free): 1 809 212 875
> Italy (toll-free): 800 793887
> Italy: +39 0 247 92 13 01
> Japan (toll-free): 0 120 663 800
> Korea, Republic of (toll-free): 0806150880 Luxembourg (toll-free): 800 
> 22104 Malaysia (toll-free): 1 800 81 6851 Mexico (toll-free): 01 800 
> 925 0372 Netherlands (toll-free): 0 800 020 0182
> Netherlands: +31 (0) 208 080 219
> New Zealand (toll-free): 0 800 47 0011 New Zealand: +64 (0) 9 280 6302 
> Norway (toll-free): 800 69 046
> Norway: +47 75 80 32 07
> Panama (toll-free): 00 800 226 8832
> Peru (toll-free): 0 800 54682
> Philippines (toll-free): 1 800 1651 0716 Poland (toll-free): 00 800 
> 1213979 Portugal (toll-free): 800 784 461 Romania (toll-free): 0 800 
> 410 029 Russian Federation (toll-free): 810 800 29674011 Saudi Arabia 
> (toll-free): 800 844 3633 Singapore (toll-free): 800 101 2992 South 
> Africa (toll-free): 0 800 983 867 Spain
> (toll-free): 800 900 582
> Spain: +34 911 82 9906
> Sweden (toll-free): 020 980 772
> Sweden: +46 (0) 852 500 186
> Switzerland (toll-free): 0 800 740 393
> Switzerland: +41 (0) 435 0167 13
> Taiwan (toll-free): 0 800 666 854
> Thailand (toll-free): 001 800 658 131
> Turkey (toll-free): 00 800 4488 23683
> Ukraine (toll-free): 0 800 50 0641
> United Arab Emirates (toll-free): 800 044 40439 United Kingdom 
> (toll-free): 0
> 808 168 0229 United Kingdom: +44 (0) 20 7151 1853 United States 
> (toll-free): 1
> 877 309 2073 Uruguay (toll-free): 000 413 598 4110 Viet Nam 
> (toll-free): 120 32
> 153
> 
> Access Code: 759-444-232
> Audio PIN: Shown after joining the meeting
> 
> Meeting ID: 759-444-232
> 
> GoToMeeting®
> Online Meetings Made Easy®
> 
> Not at your computer? Click the link to join this meeting from your 
> iPhone®, iPad® or Android® device via the GoToMeeting app.
> 
> 
> --
> Stephen Turner
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stephen Turner [mailto:Stephen.Turner@citrix.com]
> Sent: 16 December 2014 13:03
> To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: RE: CloudStack Quality Process
> 
> Were we planning to have another meeting at the same time tomorrow 
> (2014- 12-17T17:00Z)? Animesh, can you set up a GTM again?
> 
> (Hoping that no-one's going to complain about my date format if I 
> follow ISO 8601).
> 
> --
> Stephen Turner
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Animesh Chaturvedi [mailto:animesh.chaturvedi@citrix.com]
> Sent: 11 December 2014 07:23
> To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> Cc: Steve Wilson
> Subject: RE: CloudStack Quality Process
> 
> Don’t worry the first meeting went all over and the wiki needs a lot 
> of cleanup and capture of discussion that we had. Stay tuned
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Rajani Karuturi [mailto:rajani@apache.org]
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 8:48 PM
> > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Cc: Steve Wilson
> > Subject: Re: CloudStack Quality Process
> >
> > Thanks for sharing the notes. Sorry, I couldn't make it this time.
> > Will definitely plan to join the next meeting.
> >
> > ~Rajani
> >
> > On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 1:27 AM, Animesh Chaturvedi < 
> > animesh.chaturvedi@citrix.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Folks
> > >
> > > We had good initial session this morning and we have started a 
> > > public wiki [1] to allow us to collaborate. It is a scratch pad 
> > > for start and we all will refine it as we go along. The link to 
> > > recording and the chat log from today's meeting are also 
> > > referenced in the
> wiki.
> > >
> > > [1]
> > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Quality+and
> > > +P
> > > ro
> > > cess+Improvement+Initiative
> > >
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Animesh Chaturvedi [mailto:animesh.chaturvedi@citrix.com]
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 9:05 AM
> > > > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > > > Cc: Steve Wilson
> > > > Subject: RE: CloudStack Quality Process
> > > >
> > > > The meeting is on ...
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Animesh Chaturvedi 
> > > > > [mailto:animesh.chaturvedi@citrix.com]
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 8:56 PM
> > > > > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > > > > Cc: Steve Wilson
> > > > > Subject: RE: CloudStack Quality Process
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes I am planning to record the GTM
> > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: Will Stevens [mailto:williamstevens@gmail.com]
> > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 6:59 PM
> > > > > > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > > > > > Cc: Steve Wilson
> > > > > > Subject: RE: CloudStack Quality Process
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Is it possible to record the meeting? Maybe we can post it 
> > > > > > so others can view it if they are not able to attend (or 
> > > > > > only become interested after the first couple meetings and 
> > > > > > wants to catch
> up)?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Will
> > > > > > On Dec 9, 2014 9:52 PM, "Animesh Chaturvedi"
> > > > > > <animesh.chaturvedi@citrix.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > I can setup a GTM since it is free for Citrix.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Here are the details.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 1.  Please join my meeting.
> > > > > > > https://www1.gotomeeting.com/join/285394368
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 2.  Use your microphone and speakers (VoIP) - a headset is
> > > recommended.
> > > > > > > Or, call in using your telephone.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > United States: +1 (213) 493-0008 Argentina (toll-free): 0
> > > > > > > 800
> > > > > > > 444 2385 Australia (toll-free): 1 800
> > > > > > > 191 358
> > > > > > > Australia: +61 2 9091 7603 Austria (toll-free): 0 800 
> > > > > > > 080061
> > > > > > > Austria: +43 (0) 7 2088 0716 Bahrain (toll-free): 800 81 
> > > > > > > 305 Belarus (toll-free): 8 820
> > > > > > > 0011 0331 Belgium (toll-free): 0 800
> > > > > > > 81388
> > > > > > > Belgium: +32 (0) 28 08 4372 Brazil (toll-free): 0 800 047 
> > > > > > > 4909 Bulgaria (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 00800
> > > > > > > 120
> > > > > > > 4413 Canada (toll-free): 1 877 777
> > > > > > > 3281
> > > > > > > Canada: +1 (647) 497-9380
> > > > > > > Chile (toll-free): 800 395 146 China (toll-free): 4008
> > > > > > > 866154 Colombia (toll-free): 01 800 012 9057 Czech 
> > > > > > > Republic (toll-
> free):
> > > > > > > 800 500453 Denmark (toll-free): 8025 0919
> > > > > > > Denmark: +45 (0) 69 91 84 58 Finland (toll-free): 0 800
> > > > > > > 94473
> > > > > > > Finland: +358 (0) 931 58 1773 France (toll-free): 0 805 
> > > > > > > 541
> > > > > > > 052
> > > > > > > France: +33 (0) 170 950 590 Germany (toll-free): 0 800 184 
> > > > > > > 4230
> > > > > > > Germany: +49 (0) 692 5736 7300 Greece (toll-free): 00 800
> > > > > > > 4414
> > > > > > > 4282 Hong Kong (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 30774812 Hungary (toll-free): (06) 80 986 259 Iceland (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 800 9993 India (toll-free): 000 800 100 8227 Indonesia
> > > > > > > (toll-free): 001 803
> > > > > > > 020 2563 Ireland (toll-free): 1 800 818
> > > > > > > 263
> > > > > > > Ireland: +353 (0) 15 133 006 Israel (toll-free): 1 809 388
> > > > > > > 020 Italy (toll-free): 800
> > > > > > > 792289
> > > > > > > Italy: +39 0 699 26 68 65
> > > > > > > Japan (toll-free): 0 120 242 200 Korea, Republic of
> > > > > > > (toll-free): 0806180880 Luxembourg (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 800
> > > > > > > 81016 Malaysia (toll-free): 1 800 81 6860 Mexico (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 01
> > > > > > > 800
> > > > > > > 123 8367 Netherlands (toll-free): 0 800 020 0178
> > > > > > > Netherlands: +31 (0) 208 080 759 New Zealand (toll-free): 
> > > > > > > 0
> > > > > > > 800 47 0051 New Zealand: +64 (0) 9 974
> > > > > > > 9579 Norway (toll-free): 800 69 055
> > > > > > > Norway: +47 21 04 30 59
> > > > > > > Panama (toll-free): 001 800 507 2789 Peru (toll-free): 0 
> > > > > > > 800
> > > > > > > 55253 Philippines (toll-free): 1 800 1110 1565 Poland
> > > > > > > (toll-free): 00
> > > > > > > 800
> > > > > > > 3211434 Portugal (toll-free): 800 180 139 Romania (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 0
> > > > > > > 800
> > > > > > > 410 025 Russian Federation (toll-free): 8 800 100 6914 
> > > > > > > Saudi Arabia
> > > > > > > (toll-free): 800 844 3636 Singapore (toll-free): 800 101
> > > > > > > 3000 South Africa (toll-free): 0 800 555 451 Spain
> > > > > > > (toll-free): 800
> > > > > > > 900
> > > > > > > 593
> > > > > > > Spain: +34 931 76 1534
> > > > > > > Sweden (toll-free): 020 794 545
> > > > > > > Sweden: +46 (0) 852 500 691 Switzerland (toll-free): 0 800 
> > > > > > > 000 452
> > > > > > > Switzerland: +41 (0) 435 0026 89 Taiwan (toll-free): 0 800
> > > > > > > 666
> > > > > > > 846 Thailand (toll-free): 001 800 852 2442 Turkey (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 00 800
> > > > > > > 4488
> > > > > > > 29001 Ukraine (toll-free): 0 800 50 4691 United Arab 
> > > > > > > Emirates
> > > > > > > (toll-free): 800 044 40444 United Kingdom (toll-free): 0 
> > > > > > > 808
> > > > > > > 168
> > > > > > > 0209 United Kingdom: +44 (0) 20 7151 1817 United States
> > > (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 1 877
> > > > > > > 309 2070 Uruguay (toll-free): 000 405 4459 Viet Nam (toll-free):
> > > > > > > 120
> > > > > > > 32 148
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Access Code: 285-394-368
> > > > > > > Audio PIN: Shown after joining the meeting
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Meeting ID: 285-394-368
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > GoToMeeting®
> > > > > > > Online Meetings Made Easy®
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Not at your computer? Click the link to join this meeting 
> > > > > > > from your iPhone®, iPad® or Android® device via the 
> > > > > > > GoToMeeting
> app.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > > From: Pierre-Luc Dion [mailto:pdion@cloudops.com]
> > > > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2014 11:16 AM
> > > > > > > > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > > > > > > > Cc: Steve Wilson
> > > > > > > > Subject: Re: CloudStack Quality Process
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Based on Doodle. Meeting  is schedule for  Dec 10th, 17h00 UTC.
> > > > > > > freenode:
> > > > > > > > #cloudstack-meeting unless someone have a GTM.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Regards,
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 8, 2014 at 10:41 AM, Daan Hoogland 
> > > > > > > > <daan.hoogland@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > When do we call the result of the doodle? wait for wednesday?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > On Sat, Dec 6, 2014 at 5:46 PM, Chip Childers 
> > > > > > > > > <chipchilders@apache.org>
> > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > Thanks for listening to my concerns folks...  and 
> > > > > > > > > > I'll be rooting for
> > > > > > > > > those
> > > > > > > > > > of you that are "doing" to come up with some better 
> > > > > > > > > > practices for the community to adopt!
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Dec 5, 2014 at 5:07 PM, Animesh Chaturvedi < 
> > > > > > > > > > animesh.chaturvedi@citrix.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> Agreed
> > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > > > >> > From: williamstevens@gmail.com 
> > > > > > > > > >> > [mailto:williamstevens@gmail.com] On Behalf Of 
> > > > > > > > > >> > Will Stevens
> > > > > > > > > >> > Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2014 2:41 PM
> > > > > > > > > >> > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > > > > > > > > >> > Cc: Steve Wilson
> > > > > > > > > >> > Subject: Re: CloudStack Quality Process
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > I am speaking as a committer who has limited 
> > > > > > > > > >> > insight into the
> > > > > > > > > 'correct'
> > > > > > > > > >> way to do
> > > > > > > > > >> > this via Apache (so be gentle).  :)
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > I like the idea of a wiki page to help get 
> > > > > > > > > >> > everyone on the same page
> > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > >> to track
> > > > > > > > > >> > the consensus as we move forward...
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > I also agree that it is hard to come to a 
> > > > > > > > > >> > consensus on the list
> > > > > > > > > because
> > > > > > > > > >> it is really
> > > > > > > > > >> > hard to have a constructive conversation on here 
> > > > > > > > > >> > in a timely manner
> > > > > > > > > >> where the
> > > > > > > > > >> > different voices can be heard.
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > I think it would be interesting to schedule 
> > > > > > > > > >> > sessions/meetings on the
> > > > > > > > > >> list so any
> > > > > > > > > >> > interested party can join.  These 
> > > > > > > > > >> > sessions/meetings would happen in a
> > > > > > > > > >> format
> > > > > > > > > >> > like IRC where the transcript of the session can 
> > > > > > > > > >> > be later posted to
> > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > >> list as well
> > > > > > > > > >> > as a summary of the transcript so it can be 
> > > > > > > > > >> > reviewed by any member who
> > > > > > > > > >> could
> > > > > > > > > >> > not make the meeting.  This way we keep all of 
> > > > > > > > > >> > the actual conversation
> > > > > > > > > >> in the
> > > > > > > > > >> > list, but we also make it easier to actually have 
> > > > > > > > > >> > a 'conversation' at
> > > > > > > > > >> the same time.
> > > > > > > > > >> > It is hard to beat real time when working through 
> > > > > > > > > >> > this sort of
> > > > > > > stuff.
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > Does this make sense to others?  Thoughts?
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > Will
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > *Will STEVENS*
> > > > > > > > > >> > Lead Developer
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > *CloudOps* *| *Cloud Solutions Experts
> > > > > > > > > >> > 420 rue Guy *|* Montreal *|* Quebec *|* H3J 1S6 w 
> > > > > > > > > >> > cloudops.com
> > > > > > > > > >> > *|* tw @CloudOps_
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > On Thu, Dec 4, 2014 at 5:17 PM, Animesh 
> > > > > > > > > >> > Chaturvedi < animesh.chaturvedi@citrix.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > Wearing my PMC hat and with past experience on 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > these discussions we have not made much 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > progress on mailing list despite agreeing on 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > the goals and have locked
> > > horns.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > One possibility after reading Chip's email and 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > concerns I see is that, we create a wiki 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > outlining the problem space, possible
> > > > > > > > > >> > > solution(s) and their specific pros and cons 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > and have people
> > > > > > > > > >> collaborate.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > Once a general consensus is there and wiki is 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > stable we can bring it back to the mailing list 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > for final
> > > approval.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > This is open as well as requires participant a 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > higher degree of commitment to collaborate
> > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > >> > > will be more structured.
> > > > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > Thanks
> > > > > > > > > >> > > Animesh
> > > > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > On Thu, Dec 4, 2014 at 7:24 PM, Chip Childers 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > <chipchilders@apache.org>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > Steve,
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > (Speaking with my PMC hat on, but not as 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > someone that has the
> > > > > > > > > time
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > to help with this process)
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > I love the idea of moving forward with 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > resolving some of the quality process / tooling / etc...
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > challenges that we face as a project and community.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > I also love the idea that companies
> > > > > > > > > getting
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > commercial value from this project are 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > talking (as
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > companies) about how to best support the 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > project through either directing their 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > employees to work on this problem, allowing 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > those
> > > > > > > > > interested
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > the time to do so, and / or offering (as 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > Citrix
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > did) required hardware/software resources 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > to make improvements for the common good.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > Importantly, I like that the companies 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > involved are mutually agreeing that this is 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > for
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > common good.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > That said, I have a concern about the 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > outline below,
> > > > > > > > > specifically
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > in how the definition of approach and 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > eventual execution are
> > > > > > > > > >> handled.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > The proposal of taking this off-list until 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > there is a "proposal
> > > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > >> > > ratify"
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > is what I'd like to see changed. I would 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > fully expect that a fleshed out proposal 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > hitting the list would be met with more 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > discussion than you would like (and perhaps 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > even met with
> > > > > > > > > >> frustration).
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > What has worked well for us in the past, 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > where there is a need
> > > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > have those interested in "doing work" to be 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > able to focus on
> > > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > work, has been to start with a call for 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > interested parties (as
> > > > > > > > > you
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > did). Then, using a combination of threads 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > on this list and
> > > > > > > > > "live"
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > meetings, make progress on defining the 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > requirements and
> > > > > > > > > approach
> > > > > > > > > >> > incrementally.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > Execution of any work should similarly be 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > open and shared on
> > > > > > > > > this
> > > > > > > > > >> list.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > Throughout that process, allowing comments 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > and openings for participants are critical.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > One of the things we learned about using "live"
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > meetings to
> > > > > > > > > speed
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > up the consensus process in the past is to 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > make sure that while they are fantastic at 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > allowing the participants to understand
> > > > > > > > > each
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > other, it's critical to remember that (1) 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > there are no project decisions made outside 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > of the mailing lists and
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > (2) that it's important to have minutes or 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > notes from those live meetings
> > > > > > > > > shared
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > with the community as
> > > > > > > > > >> > > a
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > whole.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > Now a very real concern that some of us 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > have is getting bogged down in arguments 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > based on opinion, especially the
> > > > > > > "drive
> > > > > > > > by"
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > opinions. This issue (plus challenges with 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > people violently agreeing with each other, 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > yet talking past each other), is what
> > > > > > > > > I
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > believe has held up meaningful progress. To 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > deal with this, I suggest we all remember 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > that projects at the ASF are about 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > supporting those that "DO", while giving 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > opportunity for participation and comment 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > from those that might not currently be 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > "DOING". But those that are doing the work, 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > and collaborating to reach a shared goal, 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > shouldn't let a lack of 100% consensus on
> > > > > > > > > >> every
> > > > > > > > > >> > aspect hold back progress.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > As someone who will not be "doing" anything 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > for this effort, but has an interest in 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > maintaining this community's health and
> > > > > > > > > seeing
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > it continue to succeed, I hope my 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > suggestions and comments are
> > > > > > > > > >> helpful.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > -chip
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > On Mon, Dec 01, 2014 at 07:12:27PM +0000, 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > Steve Wilson
> > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> Hi Everyone,
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> It was great to get to see a number of you 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> at the recent CCC in
> > > > > > > > > >> > > Budapest.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > While I was there, I got to meet face to face 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > with individuals working
> > > > > > > > > >> > > for several
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > companies that have a real stake in the 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > commercial success of the
> > > > > > > > > >> > > CloudStack
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > project.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> After joining Citrix (and becoming 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> involved in
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> CloudStack)
> > > > > > > > > about
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> a
> > > > > > > > > >> > > year ago,
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > I’ve come to believe that we need to do more 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > to mature our quality
> > > > > > > > > >> > > practices
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > around this codebase.  We all like to say 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > #cloudstackworks (and
> > > > > > > > > it’s
> > > > > > > > > >> > > true), but
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > this is a massive codebase that’s used in the 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > most demanding
> > > > > > > > > >> > > situations.  We
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > have large telecommunications companies and 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > enterprises who are betting
> > > > > > > > > >> > > their
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > businesses on this software.  It has to be great!
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> There has been quite a bit of discussion 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> on the mailing list in
> > > > > > > > > >> > > recent months
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > about how we improve in this area.  There is 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > plenty of passion,
> > > > > > > > > but
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > we
> > > > > > > > > >> > > haven’t
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > made enough concrete progress as a community.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > In my discussions with key contributors as 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > CCC, there was general agreement that the DEV 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > list isn’t
> > > > > > > > > >> > > a good
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > forum for hashing out these kinds of things.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > Email is too low-bandwidth
> > > > > > > > > >> > > and too
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > impersonal.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> At CCC, I discussed with several people 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> the idea that we commission a
> > > > > > > > > >> > > small
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > sub team to go hash out a proposal for how we 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > handle the following topics within the ACS 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > community (which can then be brought back to 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > the larger community for
> > > > > ratification):
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>   *   Continuous integration and test automation
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>   *   Gating of commits
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>   *   Overall commit workflow
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> We are looking for volunteers to commit to 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> being part of this
> > > > > > > > > >> team.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > This
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > would imply a serious commitment.  We don’t 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > want hangers on or
> > > > > > > > > >> observers.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > This will entail real work and late night meetings.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > We’re looking for
> > > > > > > > > >> > > people who
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > are serious contributors to the codebase.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> From Citrix, David Nalley and Animesh 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> Chaturvedi have booth
> > > > > > > > > told
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> me
> > > > > > > > > >> > > they’re
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > willing to commit to this project.  They’ve 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > both managed ACS releases
> > > > > > > > > >> > > and have
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > a really good view into the current process — 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > and I know both are
> > > > > > > > > >> > > passionate
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > about improving our process.  From my CCC 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > discussions, I believe there
> > > > > > > > > >> > > are
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > individuals from Schuberg Philis, Shape Blue 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > and Cloud Ops who are
> > > > > > > > > >> > > willing to
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > commit to this process.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> If you are willing to be part of this team 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> to drive forward our
> > > > > > > > > >> > > community,
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > please reply here.
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> -Steve
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> Steve Wilson VP & Product Unit Manager 
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> Cloud Software Citrix @virtualsteve
> > > > > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > --
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > Daan
> > > > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > Daan
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > >
Mime
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