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From Donal Lafferty <donal.laffe...@citrix.com>
Subject RE: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
Date Fri, 21 Feb 2014 09:00:28 GMT
I prefer the focus on support that comes with David's suggestion.  Targeting the latest stable
release for a new platform greatly reduces the number of permutations to test.

Pursuing legacy systems limits the flexibility of ACS to evolve.  For instance, we'll probably
be on Java 7 in the next while, and W2K3 doesn't appear on the supported system list (see
https://www.java.com/en/download/help/sysreq.xml).  Likewise, older versions of Internet Explorer
can be quite different than what Microsoft has recently published.

My guess is that the engineering effort to get ACS working on a legacy system makes sense
as a consultancy service offered independent to ACS.  That's the case of OS/2 support ;)


DL


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alex Hitchins [mailto:alex.hitchins@shapeblue.com]
> Sent: 20 February 2014 14:29
> To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: RE: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> 
> I agree totally, my point was that while there is nothing technically stopping
> us going for w2k3 there is little reason to do so.
> 
> 
> Regards
> 
> Alex Hitchins
> 
> D: +44 1892 523 587 | S: +44 2036 030 540 | M: +44 7788 423 969
> 
> alex.hitchins@shapeblue.com
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Nalley [mailto:david@gnsa.us]
> Sent: 20 February 2014 13:24
> To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> 
> There's a difference in incidentally working and validated to work on.
> I'd limit focus to making sure it works on 2k12r2.
> 
> --David
> 
> On Thu, Feb 20, 2014 at 6:37 AM, Alex Hitchins
> <alex.hitchins@shapeblue.com> wrote:
> > I can't think of anything that wouldn't be possible on W2k3 - that said It's
> old and I can't see people having a need for it.
> >
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Alex Hitchins
> >
> > D: +44 1892 523 587 | S: +44 2036 030 540 | M: +44 7788 423 969
> >
> > alex.hitchins@shapeblue.com
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Paul Angus [mailto:paul.angus@shapeblue.com]
> > Sent: 20 February 2014 11:17
> > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: RE: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> >
> > Isn't the hyper-v support dependant on using 2012r2 ?
> >
> > So I don't know if I'd bother with going back as far as 2003
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Paul Angus
> > Cloud Architect
> > S: +44 20 3603 0540 | M: +447711418784 | T: @CloudyAngus
> > paul.angus@shapeblue.com
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Rajesh Battala [mailto:rajesh.battala@citrix.com]
> > Sent: 20 February 2014 11:13
> > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: RE: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> >
> > AFAIK, it would be windows server 2k3, 2k8 2012, 2012R2.
> >
> > Thanks
> > Rajesh Battala
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Damoder Reddy [mailto:Damoder.Reddy@citrix.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:32 PM
> > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: RE: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> >
> > One question I have is, Which version of windows we need to target?
> >
> > Thanks & Regards
> > Damodar/
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Damoder Reddy [mailto:Damoder.Reddy@citrix.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 2:04 PM
> > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: RE: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> >
> > I have tried to put all together in FS at
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Cloudstack+Win
> dowsfication as Feedback section and added my comments there.
> >
> > Please verify once and let me know if anything is to be added there.
> >
> > Thanks & Regards
> > Damodar/
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Damoder Reddy [mailto:Damoder.Reddy@citrix.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 12:32 PM
> > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: RE: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> >
> > Thank you all for your inputs.
> >
> >  I will aggregate all these things into FS  as appendix and will put comments
> there instead of replying here one by one. Once I am done with update in FS
> I will notify so that we can verify whether we are covering all or not.
> >
> > Thanks & Regards
> > Damodar/
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: abhisek basu [mailto:abhisekbasu@msn.com]
> > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2014 9:16 AM
> > To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Cc: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> >
> > Getting a Windows version will expand ACS reach to a large no of
> > audience and make it more OS independent from its core. As far as the
> > tools are concern, I am sure it's achievable, we have the most
> > enthusiastic community contributors behind :)
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On 16 Feb 2014, at 1:08 am, "Alex Hitchins"
> <alex.hitchins@shapeblue.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I would guess that Windows has tools for managing a large number of
> Hyper-V hosts? I wonder what ACS would add to that.
> >>
> >> I still think it would be a very achievable goal and worth doing.
> >>
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>
> >> Alex Hitchins
> >>
> >> D: +44 1892 523 587 | S: +44 2036 030 540 | M: +44 7788 423 969
> >>
> >> alex.hitchins@shapeblue.com
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Paul Angus [mailto:paul.angus@shapeblue.com]
> >> Sent: 15 February 2014 18:49
> >> To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> Subject: RE: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> >>
> >> My view is that anyone who wants to use Hyper-V is very unlikely to want
> to have Linux based management servers lurking around, because I think
> they'll be pretty wedded to Microsoft to want Hyper-V as the hypervisor. So
> being able to deploy windows based management servers seems essential
> to the use of Hyper-V (for better or worse).
> >>
> >> I think also there are probably a lot of Windows based Enterprises who
> also wouldn't like to a couple of stray Linux boxes running the show.  I guess
> Microsoft think there is a market for Windows based private clouds or they
> wouldn't have created the Behemoth that is the Azure Pack.
> >>
> >> ...and Apache Tomcat have managed to create a windows port - so how
> >> hard can it be? [tic]
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>
> >> Paul Angus
> >> Cloud Architect
> >> S: +44 20 3603 0540 | M: +447711418784 | T: CloudyAngus
> >> paul.angus@shapeblue.com
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: David Nalley [mailto:david@gnsa.us]
> >> Sent: 15 February 2014 18:29
> >> To: dev@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Windowsfication Of ACS
> >>
> >>> On Sat, Feb 15, 2014 at 12:57 PM, Alex Huang <Alex.Huang@citrix.com>
> wrote:
> >>> I see this as that CS management server should run anywhere java runs.
> However, I see quite a few holes in this proposal.
> >>>
> >>> - Management server should never have mounted the NFS secondary
> storage.  We need to fix that.  Please have a talk with Kelven about this.  I
> don't see us adding Samba to any machine that runs the management
> server.  If this is just about seeding the system template, it can be done as
> part of installation rather than management server.
> >>> - If I truly think about Windowsification, I think windows installer,
> windows service, opening ports in windows firewall.  I don't see any of that
> here.  Or else it's useless for windows people.
> >>>        - For java, most people write a windows service that launches the
> jvm and keeps track of the jvm.
> >>> - There's a number of things that CloudStack management server does
> today at startup that should not be there and those are what complicates the
> windowfication.   These things should be moved out of the management
> server and into installation.  What should be inside the management server
> startup procedure should be checks, rather than generations.  It should
> check for ssh key exists and the database version matches etc but it should
> not do the following.
> >>>        - Upgrade of the database
> >>>        - ssh key generation
> >>>        - iso generation.
> >>>
> >>> --Alex
> >>
> >>
> >> A couple of more to add to the list.
> >> There isn't really a good binary software dependency resolution
> >> framework for Windows (at least not that I am aware of) and you
> >> potentially need lots of different things - mysql libraries, python,
> >> ipmitool, or another shell to execute shell scripts. Look at the list
> >> of the dependencies we install in the RPMs for an idea of things that
> >> are missing. Is the plan to bundle those in the binaries? (If so, we
> >> need to be having a serious discussion around a shift of a number
> >> system requirements to dependencies which may or may not be
> >> acceptable.) With what appears to be some serious refactoring in how the
> management server works that Alex outlines and I doubt this is a short term
> goal. (e.g. 4.4 timeframe). If you are going to take on all of the refactoring
> work, please start by building tests that prove that it all works today and then
> verify the same behavior in the refactored work.
> >>
> >> --David
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> >> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended
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> company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape
> Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in
> Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a
> registered trademark.
> > This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended
> solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or
> opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily
> represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the
> intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based
> upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if
> you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a
> company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a
> company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape
> Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in
> Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a
> registered trademark.
> > This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended
> solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or
> opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily
> represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the
> intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based
> upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if
> you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a
> company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a
> company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape
> Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in
> Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a
> registered trademark.
> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended
> solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or
> opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily
> represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the
> intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based
> upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if
> you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a
> company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a
> company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape
> Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in
> Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a
> registered trademark.

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