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From Mike Kienenberger <>
Subject Re: Add ActiveRecord support to Cayenne
Date Sat, 29 Dec 2012 17:50:46 GMT
On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 8:33 AM, Ashley Aitken <> wrote:
> Finally, I am also not sure how something like ActiveRecord approach would actually work,
or be compatible with, Cayenne.  To my mind it defeats
> the whole purpose of having a container managing the persistence of a collection of objects,
not that AR is not an interesting / useful approach
> on its own.

Having used to actively develop Cayenne applications, but more
recently having to develop using JPA, which uses an AR approach, I can
say that it doesn't actually work or help to mix AR and Unit-of-work
Cayenne DataContext concepts.   You end up trying to imitate a
scratchpad area using a database transaction, which leaves an ongoing
open database connection for each DataContext.   JPA entities don't
have any easy way to be worked on as a group short of an active
database transaction.

> I haven't had anywhere near the experience with large applications / systems as I am
sure many of you have had but I thought the very point of
> OO was to encapsulate data and behaviour.  As well, the primary purpose of MVC was to
cleanly separate the presentation, application, and
> domain objects/classes.

Yes, I've had this argument used against the Cayenne way of doing
things by coworkers.   What Unit-of-work does is movie the level of OO
from the individual objects being saved to an scratchpad area.   It's
far more practical to work with a scratchpad of interrelated objects
than individual objects.   Unfortunately, the AR methodology won out,
and now we have all kinds of issues of not being able to roll back
groups of changes.   I suppose with some technologies, it would be
possible to delegate the scratchpad commit and rollback operations to
the individual objects (I've tried to do this with JPA) but it hasn't
worked well in practice.

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