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From Joe Baldwin <>
Subject Re: Odd error
Date Wed, 08 Feb 2012 16:51:52 GMT
> And your next step is to determine how the sort orderings are different (by looking at
the log results), determine why a certain sort causes a problem,

OK, but I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. :)  More importantly, I am not
sure if I have described the test results well enough. Let me try again:

Succinct Problem Symptoms (to date)
1. The FK error is generated 100% of the time (not intermittently) when I tried to add a Product
entity.  In addition, simply logging into to my app (accessing the admin table), trigger the
FK error for the Product - which was totally illogical since logging into admin does not INSERT
a Product entity.
2. I restarted tomcat and did a recursive "touch" on the JSP dir each time I performed the
test to presumably clear out the memory and cache.
3. The ONLY condition that results in a successful test is to use my development tomcat (on
my OSX laptop), or set Cayenne logging to DEBUG on the production machine.

1. I do not know how these symptoms  might point to a "sort ordering" issue based on the available
test results.
2. If the problem *NEVER* occurs while logging is set to DEBUG, then how would I check the
logs as you suggest?

This is why I have suggested that this problem is "insane"; This is sort of like a perverted
Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle. :)

Question (Based on the "DEBUG Uncertainty Principle"):
1. If the FK problem ONLY occurs with DEBUG set to FALSE then I have limited visibility into
the problem.
2. If I set DEBUG to TRUE all the time, then I am concerned I am simply hiding a bug.
3. Of course, if I set DEBUG to TRUE, then it is "Miller Time" :)

I have the feeling like some configuration file parameter might be corrupted.  If nobody has
any other ideas (give the visibility constraints), then I guess I will try to rebuild the
project cayenne config files from scratch and hack it into submission. :)  (Not looking forward
to this option.)


On Feb 8, 2012, at 11:18 AM, Mike Kienenberger wrote:

> Oops.  Didn't finish.
> And your next step is to determine how the sort orderings are
> different (by looking at the log results), determine why a certain
> sort causes a problem, and then subclass the sorter to insure it sorts
> in a consistently-valid manner each time.
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 11:15 AM, Mike Kienenberger <> wrote:
>> I think what Michael is saying is that the ashwood sorter isn't
>> guaranteed to return the same results for the same commit operation on
>> the next run after the application is restarted.   So setting the
>> logging wasn't what caused the change -- it was restarting the app.
>> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 11:02 AM, Joe Baldwin <> wrote:
>>> Well, if it is not "insane", then what should I do?  I mean if the app only works
correctly when logging is set to DEBUG then I would think that indicates a problems.  I could
run the app with DEBUG on all the time, but that would just be covering up what I would assume
is a serious problem.  What should I do next to debug this problem?
>>> More info:
>>> Each time I update my project jar file, I do a recursive "touch" (which I have
found forces tomcat to recompile all the jsp's and recognize the new jar file).  After this,
I restart tomcat.  There was a problem with the webhost's configuration of tomcat caching
static variables from the previous jar file into jsp static non-variables.   I would *presume*
this would clear out everything, but maybe not.
>>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 9:14 AM, Michael Gentry wrote:
>>>> On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 6:03 PM, Joe Baldwin <>
>>>>> 2. So I found their file and inserted ""
 (I hope this is what you were thinking of)
>>>> I actually think you want INFO instead of DEBUG.
>>>>> 4. Rod Serling moment: when I tried to add the Product entity - for the
first time it did not fail
>>>>>        - detail: it added the Product, there was no Exception
>>>>>        - I verified the Product by listing all of my products
>>>>> So, is this 1. Insane, or 2. totally Insane?
>>>> I've seen AshwoodEntitySorter produce different insert orderings
>>>> before from different starts.  Since you shutdown the application, AES
>>>> would have to produce a new dependency graph on startup.  I'm not
>>>> saying this is responsible, but it is a possibility.  So: 0. Maybe not
>>>> insane.  :-)
>>>> mrg

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