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From Michael Gentry <>
Subject Re: Web Performance
Date Thu, 18 Aug 2011 19:15:57 GMT
Hi Joe,

One of the reasons I mentioned T5 is because you can start on a small
project with it (just like PHP) and scale it quite nicely (we are
using T5 in small and large projects).  I don't have any PHP vs T5
benchmarks for you, but someone benchmarked several Java frameworks
and produced this:

T5 does quite nicely in it, plus is fairly interactive in the
development cycle, just like PHP.  I also get to use Cayenne with it.



PS. I'd rather have an M6 ...

On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 2:48 PM, Joe Baldwin <> wrote:
> I am surprised by the response and the comments and links are all valuable.  I think
that this input leads me to refining the question a bit.   I think the follow up question
should be: 'what are the boundary conditions - or maybe what are the strengths and applicability'?
> Concerning PHP vs Java: I read the comment 'you can't compare the two'.  I also read
the OnePixelAhead summary.  I read the great link on the PHP ORM project. I also read the
comments from Jo (which seem to mirror my own notions).  In addition, I just found this claim
(I have not found any substantiation other than this article which concludes that a "raw"
benchmark test shows Java is 28 times faster than PHP - a rather significant number if correct)
> Further clarification for the follow up question: The biggest problem I am having right
now is the *perception* (which is why I am trying to get dispassionate analysis) - that 'PHP
is great because WordPress is using it and why, for God's ask would you write something in
JSP & Cayenne' etc, etc - I won't bore you - but I am trying to stay out of holy-war-ing
it up and use real numbers and boundary conditions.  I think I am *trying* to get an answer
from an *outsider's* perspective or perhaps a project manager's perspective (who as we all
know sometimes are thrust into the manager's chair without having programmed 1 line of code
> RE the great comment concerning Facebook being written in PHP - well I have to agree
but I would also be forced to agree that you could write Facebook in assembly language - it
would be insane but it could be done - I would personally be able to manage the project however
I wouldn't want to put it on my resume because it is - errr - like totally stupid. :)
> I think the followup question is analogous to: you have a Prius (
and a Fararri ( - so WHICH CAR IS BETTER?  Well clearly
this is a stupid question - but it illustrates what I believe to be the type of question we
have with PHP vs Java.  Clearly the Fararri can be driven around town at 25-45 MPH and it
is legal and will do just fine - the car won't be happy about this and really wants to drive
at 150 MPH to keep its moral up - but it will do the job (of course the fararri is Java if
you haven't guessed :) ).
> This might be a bit off the mark for Cayenne.  However, Cayenne is affected by a cogent
PHP-Java applicability study that can be articulated and that has dispassionate real numbers
to back it up.
> IMHO - for right now, I believe Java to be a cogent language written from the ground
up with an OO design pattern.  That the performance is near C++ speeds.  That the libraries
available are professional and reliable. That Cayenne Rocks!. But, that PHP can be used to
tackle very small projects very quickly, and that if you have a high tolerance for pain it
could be used for a large project.
> Thanks (and sorry for the length),
> Joe

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