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From Hadrian Zbarcea <>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Some thoughts about the architecture of camel
Date Tue, 19 Oct 2010 15:13:29 GMT
I feel that we're mostly in violent agreement :). Comments inline.


On Oct 19, 2010, at 10:21 AM, James Strachan wrote:

> On 19 October 2010 15:06, Hadrian Zbarcea <> wrote:
>> If you think it's a good idea, and I agree, then 3.0 *is* the right time to do it.
It's some 5-6 months away, there's plenty of time and I expect us to get a lot of help from
the growing community.
>> Pushing this for 4.0 is much less realistic, we won't have another major release
in 2011. I also agree that we should be backwards compatible as much as possible, but the
truth is this is a major version and should come with major improvements. Moving to a major
release of a dependent jar, is not a major improvement we do it all the time (even if the
dependency is spring).
>> We need to first agree how 3.0 will be a major improvement.
> We've already said, moving (like many of our dependencies) to Spring 3
> and JDK 6 is a pretty big jump folks need to be aware of; its not a
> minor incremental feature release.
I meant camel 3.0, right?

>> Setting a release time and have that contain whatever we manage to code until then
sounds to me like Microsoft in its early days.
> I've no idea what you're talking about to be honest. Why are you so
> hung up with clinging to 2.6 when we're making a clear, big dependency
> jump to Java 6 and Spring 3?
I am not clinging to anything, I stated that moving to jdk6 is very possible in 2.6, or 2.7,
or 3.0. Not so much for a maintenance release like 2.5.x for instance. Maybe we should consider
having more maintenance releases like other projects (amq for instance). That said, personally
I would love to move to jdk6 as soon as possible (hence my mentioning of camel 2.6). I had
quite a bunch of failing java5 builds that I wasted time on with this release, and almost
all developers use only java6 anyway. What java version are you using?

> Try putting yourself in the position of a user; in Camel up to now you
> can move from 2.x to 2.(x+1) without worrying too much about it, it
> mostly just works. For 3.x we want folks to ponder for second about
> JDK and Spring dependencies. OK?
Oh, believe me, I do :).

Fair enough, I agree with that. And while they're at it, they can still use 2.x for as long
as they want, 2.x will be actively maintained until at least the and of 2011, we discussed
There is also no absolute must to be fully backwards compatible in camel 3.0. Heck, in some
respects we are not fully backwards compatible between minor releases. Highly desired though,
I agree.

On top of all that, there is no agreement on what should be done in camel 3.0 (as the wiki
page clearly states as well). People are throwing in proposals, and now's definitely the right
time, and we are respectfully considering them, and then we'll make decisions based on lazy
consensus or other vote. I find the camel community a highly educated bunch, we can talk each
other into (or out of) different proposals and solutions.

Let's discuss our proposals and options. If anybody has other proposals, put them on the table.
I hope we can clarify most of it in the next weeks and start hacking. Apachecon would be a
great place to meet face to face and agree on details, btw.


> -- 
> James
> -------
> Open Source Integration

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