Return-Path: Delivered-To: apmail-avalon-dev-archive@www.apache.org Received: (qmail 70891 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2004 07:25:16 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (209.237.227.199) by minotaur-2.apache.org with SMTP; 26 Sep 2004 07:25:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 20459 invoked by uid 500); 26 Sep 2004 07:25:16 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-avalon-dev-archive@avalon.apache.org Received: (qmail 20228 invoked by uid 500); 26 Sep 2004 07:25:15 -0000 Mailing-List: contact dev-help@avalon.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Help: List-Post: List-Id: "Avalon Developers List" Reply-To: "Avalon Developers List" Delivered-To: mailing list dev@avalon.apache.org Received: (qmail 20215 invoked by uid 99); 26 Sep 2004 07:25:14 -0000 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=10.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFC_ABUSE,DNS_FROM_RFC_POST,FORGED_RCVD_HELO X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: neutral (hermes.apache.org: local policy) Received: from [209.226.175.34] (HELO tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net) (209.226.175.34) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.28) with ESMTP; Sun, 26 Sep 2004 00:25:13 -0700 Received: from everest.konova.com ([69.157.236.152]) by tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.10 201-253-122-130-110-20040306) with ESMTP id <20040926072510.CMRZ4905.tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net@everest.konova.com> for ; Sun, 26 Sep 2004 03:25:10 -0400 Received: from SHINFUJI (IDENT:root@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by everest.konova.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id i8Q7P6605300 for ; Sun, 26 Sep 2004 03:25:07 -0400 Reply-To: From: "David Leangen" To: "Avalon Developers List" Subject: RE: [VOTE] Stephen McConnell as a committer Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2004 16:25:07 +0900 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <001b01c4a398$4b263c50$1601a8c0@gloria> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Virus-Checked: Checked X-Spam-Rating: minotaur-2.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N > I would argue that a community is made up through a cycle of value. I > think that a cycle of value limited to developers 'scratching an itch' > is too restrictive. > > Instead the interesting things start happening when you introduce users > into that cycle. In particular you start to see much more discussion > around competence development by the end-user. This leads to closer > involvement in the development of functional requirements, input into > product positioning and promotion, and interestingly, professional > network development linking users-with-other-users and > users-with-developers. I definately agree with this point of view. At the risk of creating a circular argument, though, "value" depends on what is meant by "community". If by "community" you mean only the contributors to the project, then what is valuable to this community is certainly different from what would be valuable if users were also thought of as part of the community. So, determining what value is depends on what you mean by "community". Maybe that's the major point that needs to be cleared up first. If you decide that users are indeed an important part of the community, then I would highly recommend that Steve be part of the process, since, as far as I've seen, he is very concerned about the users, more than anybody else I've seen. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@avalon.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@avalon.apache.org