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From Berin Loritsch <blorit...@apache.org>
Subject Re: http://avalon.apache.org/
Date Tue, 28 Jan 2003 14:25:40 GMT
Leo Simons wrote:

 > Stephen McConnell wrote:
 >
 >> Thanks a million for getting this done.
 >>
 >> I would like to get some feedback and opinions about the Avalon 
webpages bacause I think now is the time to handle any restructing of 
approach, message, and so on.  I think the historical project oriented 
approach has left a lot of users confussed and has negivively impacted 
the take up on Avalon.  I would like to suggest we rethink the the 
subjects we are trying to comminicate and get down to some good 
old-fasshioned human engineering on our web site.
 >>
 >> I see two distinct "views" of Avalon - a "products view" and a 
"functional view":
 >>
 >> If I compare this with the old and current Avalon site I see total 
domination of of the Project/CVS view - Framework, Excalibur, 
Cornerstone, Phoneix, Apps, Logkit (horizontally and vertically). 
Content presention should not been driven by the CVS structure - instead 
content and structure should be addressing utility for the customer.
 >
 >
 > <snip>
 >
 >> Thoughts?
 >
 >
 >
 > Open source documentation is driven by the needs of the developer, 
not the utility towards the customer. The need avalon has wrt 
documentation atm is


But our customers *are* developers.  It's not hard to understand what we
need.

 > - making lots of things explicit (like the term "appliance") so we 
are no longer confused ourselves
 > - writing user documentation for our products. Ie, if you use a 
product, how do you do so? Which features does it have, and how do you 
use those? Where is the product heading?
 > - documentation on how our community and development process works 
(and I'll be hopefully just referring to incubator docs when I get 
access there :D)


Right.  All those things are needed.

 > You cannot get at functional view until you have a reasonably 
complete product view. And the functional view is a bitch to maintain 
simply because no-one ever feels like maintaining it (just look at OSS 
history: it doesn't work). Even the "guidebook/tutorial" view (which is 
the third one), ie "Developing with Avalon", is something no-one really 
feels like maintaining.


Something like that should not need to be altered that much.  It is
meant to be a high level text.  As the preferred container changes, it
should be updated to reflect that, but nothing more.


 > If you are more confident than me, please do go set it up :D But I'd 
rather have you invest that energy in product/guidebook view first until 
that documentation is reasonably correct and up-to-date.


Things like API docs, downloads, etc. are not going to change often.
Putting those at the top are important.



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