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From Giacomo Pati <giac...@apache.org>
Subject RE: Relationships between Jakarta projects...
Date Wed, 22 Aug 2001 09:51:57 GMT
Quoting Leo Simons <mail@leosimons.com>:

> > On Wed, 22 Aug 2001 09:02, Paul Hammant wrote:
> > > >And this is probably the hardest part of it.
> yup. Which doesn't mean we shouldn't try =)
> > > > Since we are all 
> > individuls
> > > >here doing things on a voluntary basis and have our very own 
> > preferences
> > > >(babies) this we almost never happen. If Apache would run
> "commercial"
> > > >procedure we clearly had less overlay between the projects and 
> > some guys
> > > >from the IT architecture department will tell the other guys in the
> > > >development department what they had to use for their apps. And the
> > > >management clearly knows that human resources are the most 
> > costly factor
> > > >in the IT departments! This is what Apache doesn't have to pay for
> and
> > > >thus have to allow much more individuality for every one of us.
> > >
> > > True, but other teams could <b>decide</b> that Avalon is good enough
> to
> > > be a foundation at some point.  I think it all starts with Tomcat. 
> If
> > > we ported a simple HTTP server (resurrect PicoServer) to Avalon,
> then
> > > the Tomcat team might like what they see and make plans themselves.
> What I also don't see happening (or is there some mailing list I
> don't know of) is regular communication between programmers on
> different projects.
> In my experience, doing things like this, on a voluntary basis,
> first requires some community feel. If there is no-one who sees
> Jakarta as a community place, there is no-one wo wants to put
> all that extra effort in to make things work together.
> > It will be a while before TC5 comes around (could be years off). 
> > Before we 
> > even approach them there are still things that needs to be done 
> > to phoenix to 
> > make it "worthy". A while back phoenix became "acceptable" for my 
> > uses (ie it 
> > does everything I need at this stage) and thus development slowed 
> > a little. 
> > It will eventually get to killer-app status I hope .. just takes time.
> Hopefully, this will be before development of Tomcat 5 starts.
> If it's not, well, it would be useful to talk to the tomcat
> developer team about them helping out porting utility code from
> tomcat to Phoenix, or them specifying what they would like
> different in phoenix.
> Just an example, but the point is clear: communication and team
> spirit are a first requirment.

Just a FYI. Grepping the catalina tree in the tomcat-4 repo for 'avalon' 
will shows you the file catalina/src/conf/catalina.conf.xml containing:

    <block class="org.apache.catalina.startup.CatalinaBlock" 
           name="catalina" >
      <logger name="Servlet container" 

Remi already thought of starting something sometimes. From the CVS I've got

- Add a wrapper to enable management of Tomcat 4 by Avalon.
- Use the new "dist-opt-avalon" target in the Catalina build file to build the
  Avalon block. This is NOT part of the "dist" target because of limitations
  in the current Ant (the problem seems to be that this build file is actually
  used from the main Tomcat build file; any help to resolve this would be
  This target assumes that Avalon is in ../../dist/avalon. There is an
  avalon.dist property which can be used to point to another location.
- The Avalon block (catalina.bar) contains a configuration file which has
  a path element which must point to the Tomcat 4 distribution. If Avalon is
  in the directory mentioned above, then the defaults are fine.
- The wrapper has been successfully tested with Avalon 3.0a3.


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