From dev-return-24850-apmail-apr-dev-archive=apr.apache.org@apr.apache.org Sun Apr 8 13:49:23 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: apmail-apr-dev-archive@www.apache.org Delivered-To: apmail-apr-dev-archive@www.apache.org Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by minotaur.apache.org (Postfix) with SMTP id EF4EE9B47 for ; Sun, 8 Apr 2012 13:49:22 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 33518 invoked by uid 500); 8 Apr 2012 13:49:22 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-apr-dev-archive@apr.apache.org Received: (qmail 33372 invoked by uid 500); 8 Apr 2012 13:49:22 -0000 Mailing-List: contact dev-help@apr.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Id: Delivered-To: mailing list dev@apr.apache.org Received: (qmail 33363 invoked by uid 99); 8 Apr 2012 13:49:22 -0000 Received: from athena.apache.org (HELO athena.apache.org) (140.211.11.136) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sun, 08 Apr 2012 13:49:22 +0000 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.7 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (athena.apache.org: domain of trawick@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.50 as permitted sender) Received: from [209.85.212.50] (HELO mail-vb0-f50.google.com) (209.85.212.50) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sun, 08 Apr 2012 13:49:15 +0000 Received: by vbnl22 with SMTP id l22so2820000vbn.37 for ; Sun, 08 Apr 2012 06:48:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=RoH5QjEFi2hhZx68sBLLUPJ4q33E1oqK8M24YZIPmGU=; b=swIxcldwxW4NXbqsCdlwVQHZE/L9ADWm80aWYfHhGI9NCuLkyzgVe7H8P7nRMhugb9 VLtuKOoi4TbAYJo4rM/8Fvs8OkewDm4XW4qdWka3x072iJp1WsGBYe9ha0qA+qMeiQte SDn5cjNQmM76rmrQGR3YHlX+Cu2mrdkSkqMTah56t4B3j7C4yWDkUPOAORsPlpB4+Ll2 OAjk2ApdPIFQHQ2dHF/Jr3WwBQV/MlnldiWdwPYWfH8Ku3aICHZWjIrX/nDUROW3yH0j 5VYwKYcLqD21ZemM2UwDlU3eWSAdMLnTbi++vhwcytuai4G68MLwaesU9gYpo9CdblfX HGNQ== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.175.231 with SMTP id cd7mr1713868vdc.68.1333892935111; Sun, 08 Apr 2012 06:48:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.215.3 with HTTP; Sun, 8 Apr 2012 06:48:55 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 8 Apr 2012 09:48:55 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: modes of discussion From: Jeff Trawick To: dev@apr.apache.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org Some of the behavior here is embarrassing. Yelling about not following procedures that nobody else even follows as stated, threatening, whining, crudity or at least making fun of objections to crudity, extreme defensiveness, etc. do not reflect well on us or our ability to do anything together. Even without staking out extreme positions, attempts to communicate concerns in the simplest manner can elicit very strong emotional reactions which feed the frenzy. Some less active participants must see it as a poor statement on the human condition that there can be such fireworks about such a simple little project. We need to try harder to avoid the extreme offensive and defensive positions and acknowledge that e-mail is a limited tool in the best of circumstances, and that some of us are enigmas to each other even in the best of circumstances.