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From Alex Russell <>
Subject Re: Verbosity... [WAS: RE: problems with javac...]
Date Thu, 05 Jun 2003 16:34:27 GMT
Hash: SHA1

On Thursday 05 June 2003 10:56 am, Dominique Devienne wrote:
> Now come on, that's a nasty jab at Java Developers ;-)

It wasn't meant as a jab, just a frustrated observation that of all 
the languages I write in, and all of the communities of developers 
that I interact with, Java developers seem to send me the most 
un-necessarialy verbose replies.

> It's more likely Outlook's fault or rather the fact that few people
> configure it to reply with the previous message >'d, 'cause it
> messes up poor Outlook's spell checking... (that's my reason at
> least)

I guess that makes some sense. I suppose brain-dead MUA's can't be 
helped in some environments.

> And yes, Java is verbose.

Well, that much I know = )

> Maybe you prefer Fortran's brevity of
> method names? Or the potentially numerous function calls hiding in
> a seemingly simple C++ statement? Bertran Meyer didn't even include
> method overloads in Eiffel to avoid even further confusion. Java's
> verbosity is part of its strength, and shows you explicitly almost
> everything that's going on. I'm also a fan of C++ for its power,
> and gripped about Java's verbosity at the beginning, but I've come
> to greatly appreciate it...

My commentary wasn't on the language. I think Java is a fine language 
for many tasks, and I write in Java when it is the best tool for the 

My comment was in regard to mailing list discussions. Whether there is 
a correlation between language verbosity and programmer verbosity, I 
don't know. I doubt I could make a case either way. However, it was 
my observation that fewer people here seem to have an understanding 
similar to mine of what kosher behavior on public lists consists of.

I just know that when I'm catching up on the hundreds of messages from 
the various lists I'm on, it is much easier to get to the meat of an 
issue when replies are placed in context, thread ID headers are 
preserved, and replies are trimmed. I was frustrated because none of 
those conventions seem to be in effect around here.

- -- 
Alex Russell
Version: GnuPG v1.2.2-rc1-SuSE (GNU/Linux)


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