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From Matt Benson <gudnabr...@yahoo.com>
Subject Re: AW: Graphical editor of the Build.xml
Date Wed, 04 Jun 2003 15:31:47 GMT
I didn't quite understand that last sentence... but
maybe it's just because I haven't read the article in
over a year?

-Matt

--- peter reilly <peter.reilly@corvil.com> wrote:
> Maybe I was a bit quick to say that the
> article is ridiculous.
> The article does however use the attribute is
> element text
> syntax to make a some  strawman examples.
> 
> Peter
> 
> On Wednesday 04 June 2003 16:05, Matt Benson wrote:
> > Definitely WAY better than make files, no
> question.
> > But the point Ter makes in the article is
> interesting:
> >  XML, while useful for representing data, is
> contrary
> > in structure to our instinctive thought processes.
>  I
> > can't prove how your thought processes work, but
> it
> > would make sense for these to be reflected in the
> > structure of spoken language.  I suppose this
> comes
> > back to machines interpreting human language to do
> > useful work, which is a long way off and would
> > probably put most of us out of a job.
> >
> > -Matt
> >
> > --- peter reilly <peter.reilly@corvil.com> wrote:
> > > That is one ridiculous article.
> > >
> > > I have always found the syntax of
> > > ant scripts easier than the nonsense of make
> files.
> > >
> > > Peter
> > >
> > > On Wednesday 04 June 2003 15:38, Matt Benson
> wrote:
> > > > Again, I think such a tool probably would be
> very
> > > > clumsy; I was only trying to answer the
> original
> > > > question as I interpreted it.  However, you
> can
> > >
> > > read
> > >
> > > > an argument in favor of such a tool
> abstracting
> > >
> > > the
> > >
> > > > build.xml into some other representation in
> > >
> > > Terence
> > >
> > > > Parr's article "Humans should not have to grok
> > >
> > > XML":
> >
> >
>
http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/xml/library/x-sbxml.html
> >
> > > > -Matt
> > > >
> > > > --- Jan.Materne@rzf.fin-nrw.de wrote:
> > > > > No, yes, ...
> > > > > We think that the original questions goes in
> > >
> > > that
> > >
> > > > > direction, but
> > > > > that wasn´t quite clear. What is a
> "graphical
> > >
> > > IDE"?
> > >
> > > > > We gave some examples on text based editors
> with
> > > > > nice features like
> > > > > syntax highlighting and more.
> > > > > For "reverse engeneering" the buildfile we
> have
> > > > > VizAnt.
> > > > > But we don´t know any tools for "forward
> > >
> > > engeneer"
> > >
> > > > > buildfiles from
> > > > > any kind of models - and we thought, that
> this
> > >
> > > isn´t
> > >
> > > > > very useful, because
> > > > > to much special things have to specified
> > >
> > > therefore
> > >
> > > > > direct writing is quite
> > > > > easier and faster.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Jan
> > > > >
> > > > > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> > > > > > Von: Matt Benson
> [mailto:gudnabrsam@yahoo.com]
> > > > > > Gesendet am: Dienstag, 3. Juni 2003 23:25
> > > > > > An: Ant Users List
> > > > > > Betreff: Re: Graphical editor of the
> Build.xml
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Oh, that... I had read that before; I
> thought
> > >
> > > we
> > >
> > > > > were
> > > > >
> > > > > > talking about a way to graphically edit
> build
> > > > >
> > > > > files.
> > > > >
> > > > > > -Matt
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- Jacob Kjome <hoju@visi.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > You need to install the native graphviz
> > >
> > > program
> > >
> > > > > for
> > > > >
> > > > > > > your particular
> > > > > > > platform and then grab vizant from here:
> > > > > > > http://sourceforge.net/projects/vizant
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Then do something like...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >      <target name="vizant">
> > > > > > >          <taskdef name="vizant"
> > > > > > >
> classname="net.sourceforge.vizant.Vizant"
> > > > > > > classpath="${vizant.jar}"/>
> > > > > > >          <vizant antfile="build.xml"
> > > > > > > outfile="build.dot"/>
> > > > > > >          <exec executable="dot"
> > > > > > > failifexecutionfails="false"
> > > > > > > resultproperty="graphvizSuccess!">
> > > > > > >              <arg line="-Tpng build.dot
> -o
> > > > > > > build.png"/>
> > > > > > >          </exec>
> > > > > > >          <fail
> unless="graphvizSuccess!">
> > > > > > >          You probably need to install
> > >
> > > GraphViz
> > >
> > > > > which
> > > > >
> > > > > > > is a native program,
> > > > > > >          not a Java library &gt;&gt;&gt;
> > >
> > > http://www.research.att.com/sw/tools/graphviz/
> > >
> > > > > > >          </fail>
> > > > > > >      </target>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Jake
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > At 01:34 PM 6/3/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> > > > > > > >I visited the link but it wasn't
> > >
> > > immediately
> > >
> > > > > > > obvious
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >to me how to use this tool with Ant. 
> Can
> > >
> > > you
> > >
> > > > > > > >elaborate?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >Thanks,
> > > > > > > >Matt
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >--- Markus Dettori
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > <markus.dettori@wuerth-phoenix.com>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, June 03, 2003 4:36 PM
> > > > >
> > > > > [GMT+1=CET],
> > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Jan.Materne@rzf.fin-nrw.de
> > > > > > > > > <Jan.Materne@rzf.fin-nrw.de>
> scribbled
> 
=== message truncated ===


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