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From Mike Deibler <>
Subject Re: target as a property
Date Thu, 26 Jul 2001 16:30:55 GMT
Can we quantify the number of people who really want these features?
Basing the result on the messages on this list won't give a good representation.
Are the list members a good cross-section of all ant users?  Are the
posts even representative of the list members in general (i.e. how many
uninterrested lurkers are out there)?

Perhaps a more formal feature voting process should be evolved to gauge
the true user interest in potential feature additions.  How that can be
accomplished is unclear.



Christopher Berry wrote:
> This seems to be a recurring theme in the Ant world.
> I would like to add something::  Great software is grown. It evolves. It is
> constantly rethought, and refactored. The most important thing we can do is
> listen --  listen to the code, and listen to the User's of that code.
> Feedback is critical. And reacting to that feedback is the essence of
> evolution.
> Over and over, a great many Ant User's keep asking for the same features.
> E.g. <foreach>, <if>, <unsetproperty>, ${target}, etc., etc. Are we
> misguided souls?? Isn't it possible that we are supplying valid feedback??
> Feedback that could take Ant to even greater places??
> Remember that these User's are just poor souls like me, with real-world
> problems to solve -- with real deadlines -- often working in large, existing
> "make" systems. Architectural Purity is often a luxury we cannot afford.
> Is bifurcating Ant really a valid option??
> Maybe it is time to let go a little. Like a proud parent seeing your child
> grow. Not necessarily always in the direction you might choose. But that's
> just part of being a parent.
> All that said, Pete, I am a very big fan of Ant. Big enough that I have gone
> out on a limb to introduce it into a large, complicated build system -- in
> an organization somewhat intimidated by change.
> I really appreciate what you, Conor, Stefan, Diane, et al are doing.
> Thanks for listening,
> -- Chris

Mike Deibler
Manager, Portal Engineering
NocPulse, Inc.
1293 Mountain View-Alviso Road, Suite D
Sunnyvale, CA  94089

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