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From "Ventimiglia, David" <>
Subject RE: Psychology and community.
Date Tue, 05 Jun 2001 18:30:01 GMT
Nevertheless, it's hard for anyone else to know how to change the
documentation to meet your approval.  Since only you know exactly what you
want, you're in the best position to do something about it.  The catch is
that if you knew all that you needed in order to improve the docs, you'd
already be past the stage where you need docs.  Given that, the already
established Ant community, and the willingness of its members to help,
you'll probably get farther if you ask people on the list what all the tasks
are used for.  Armed with that knowledge and some experience, you'll have no
trouble writing exactly the documentation you want and think others might
find useful.

The thing is, you have at your disposal an incredibly useful tool that other
people donated many hours to.  You're getting it essentially for free.  The
only price is that you may have to work a little harder (eg., learn how to
submit a patch) to get exactly what you want.


-----Original Message-----
From: Swart, James (Jim) ** CTR ** []
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2001 10:42 AM
To: ''
Subject: RE: Psychology and community.

wow.  *claps hands and gives a standing ovation*.. that was well put.

-----Original Message-----
From: []
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2001 11:33 AM
Subject: Psychology and community.

Responding "Well, submit a patch, then" to every gripe has several flaws.

 + The griper is familliar enough with development tools to mechanically
   accomplish a patch generation

 + The griper is sufficiently familiar with java that they are capable of
   coding the new behavior

 + The griper is sufficiently familiar with ant that they are capable of
   presenting a patch from which the maintainers will not flee, holding

Additionally, it presents a tremendously arrogant perspective to the rest of
the user (and thus potential developer) community.  It is much more work to
deflect these gripes productively, but then that's why the prominent members
of the team want to get there, right?  You want a better, coherent product,
not some slapped-together collision of philosophies coded piecemeal by

.... Right?

I've gotten and seen this response several times.  I'm trying to shut up and
soldier for my own part.  However, I'm a bit intimidated by the ant
especially as active as the development list is... and I consider myself
than trivially clued about development strategies.  It'd be especially
intimidating to someone who's looking at ant to -learn- how to do project

The sum message is that the ant-clue don't think enough of the feedback to
even respond politely.

- Allen S. Rout
- paying dues working on ant-wise cvs maintainance tasks, as suggested.

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