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From Hiram Chirino <>
Subject Re: AMQP client library collaboration
Date Fri, 11 Jun 2010 13:09:50 GMT
BTW, I've created the mailing list on google groups that was suggested
on earlier posts:

Group home page:

I think it would be a good idea to move this discussion there since
this thread is getting cross posted across a couple groups who's
interest level varies.  If this topic is of interest to you please
join the discussion there.

On Fri, Jun 11, 2010 at 9:01 AM, Rajith Attapattu <> wrote:
> Frankly I am a bit baffled about the concerns raised here.
> Rob, Bruce, Rafi and a few individuals have expressed a desire to
> start an amqp protocol client project that is independent of any AMQP
> projects that already exist.
> The goal is to enable collaboration from anybody who is interested in
> AMQP and to avoid duplication of effort.
> To this end Bruce has extended an invitation to the developers in the
> Qpid/ActiveMQ communities to participate in this.
> **Also as Rob mentioned, it's upto the Qpid/ActiveMQ communities to
> use these client libs or not.** - However common sense suggests that
> we stand to be benefit if we use it, provided that it's designed
> properly which I am sure it will be.
> If we think pragmatically, there are many good reasons why such a
> project needs to be independent instead of being affiliated with an
> existing AMQP project.
> 1. All though Qpid, ActiveMQ, RabbitMQ etc.. are open source projects,
> they all have their own identity, their own communities, different
> companies backing them etc.
>    If this proposed project goes under any of the existing projects
> then it is inevitable that people will feel that the chosen community
> will have more influence over the project than the others.
>    This is not a good thing !
> 2. If this project is independent, then we will likely get
> participation from a wider audience, not just folks from the above
> mentioned communities.
> 3. It is IMO absurd to require a RabbitMQ developer to earn karma in
> the Qpid/ActiveMQ project to contribute effectively to this project.
> Regards,
> Rajith
> On Fri, Jun 11, 2010 at 4:04 AM, Robert Godfrey <> wrote:
>> On 11 June 2010 08:48, Bruce Snyder <> wrote:
>>> On Thu, Jun 10, 2010 at 8:54 PM, Marnie McCormack
>>> <> wrote:
>>>> I'm not sure what the best solution is, but I do know that I'm missing what
>>>> the problem using one of the Apache projects for this work is ?
>>>> It seems like there some context missing from this debate, possibly from
>>>> discussions at the F2F.
>>>> Bruce - can you elaborate on why other people might not want to work on AMQP
>>>> under an Apache project but would want to work on it as another open source
>>>> project and use an ASL license ?
>>> Why would someone who works on an AMQP broker implementation that is
>>> not Qpid want to come to the Qpid project to contribute to an AMQP
>>> protocol level client? If this project were hosted as a subproject to
>>> Qpid, it would forever be associated with Qpid instead of being
>>> neutral from any broker.
>> Moreover those people would not find it possible to commit without
>> gaining committership to the relevant Apache project.  I was talking
>> this evening to one of the guys from RabbitMQ who would very much want
>> to be involved in this - and I very much want to encourage this.
>> I think we should see this idea as something that may be of interest
>> to particular Qpid, ActiveMQ, Rabbit or other developers... not
>> something that involves those projects in themselves.  In the future
>> those projects may decide to adopt work that is done in this space (or
>> not)... but really what we are saying is that we feel like there are a
>> number of people from different communities who feel like it would be
>> worthwhile to have a go at this - and we're seeing how many other like
>> minded folks there are.  There are, of course, also likely to be
>> developers in these communities to whom this is of no interest
>> whatsoever.
>>>> It seems a little like double overhead for those already working on Qpid
>>>> ActiveMQ to have a third project in the loop, with different lists and
>>>> process and all that. Having been around for a while I understand the
>>>> overhead with Apache, but I'm also concerned that we haven't really talked
>>>> about what we gain from a non-Apache project - what the gain from doing the
>>>> core libraries somewhere else ?
>>> Because it lowers the barrier of participation and is not associated
>>> with any particular AMQP impl.
>> +1  I think it was a great sign that so many people from different
>> communities were willing to try to start up something like this - and
>> obviously if there are more people out there that will be even
>> better... I really want to do as much as possible to encourage this
>> effort and lower the barriers of entry for anyone who is interested as
>> much as possible
>> -- Rob
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Apache Qpid - AMQP Messaging Implementation
>> Project:
>> Use/Interact:
> --
> Regards,
> Rajith Attapattu
> Red Hat
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Apache Qpid - AMQP Messaging Implementation
> Project:
> Use/Interact:



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